Five Reasons not to buy an iPhone

[Eddie Echoplex]

I think I'd rather wait for a better phone than to go with the hype. I don't have the money for it and even if I did, I'd still have to wait because it won't sell in Mexico in a while (yeah, the world hates us on stuff like this :bored: ).

Why I'm Not Getting an iPhone

Tue Jun 26, 2007 7:06PM EDT

* Price/Storage: Probably the biggest reason to wait is the price.The iPhone will retail in stores for $500 (4GB) and $600 (8GB) — AND you still have to sign a new two-year agreement. Don't expect this phone to replace your iPod either. The top-of-the-line $600, 8GB iPhone only holds 2,000 songs, and only a handful of videos and full-length movies. I also don't understand why you have to buy the iPhone at full price, and still sign a two-year contract. You could easily get a comparable phone actually running on a 3G network like a Treo 750 for $199 with a two-year contract, or an 80GB video iPod for almost half the price.

* Plans: What's really bothering me about this is AT&T is playing into all this hype too, forgetting about its customers. I called AT&T today to find out more details about switching carriers, and the rep was clueless. Come on guys, we needed pricing details about a month before the phone went on sale so we could estimate costs. Why is the company being so secretive? We know the phone is launching on Friday, and we know what it does. So why did it wait so long to reveal service plans? At least now we know getting an iPhone isn't going to be cheap. Chris Null outlined the cost of each service plan, the cheapest plan being $60/mo for 450 minutes. He says that in two years, you'll end up paying close to $2,000 for service alone. Plus there is that $36 activation fee, and a two-year contract on top of that. Those who already have an AT&T account can expect to pay an additional $20-$30 for the "iPhone plan" which includes Visual Voicemail, 200 SMS text messages, and unlimited data since there is no voice-only plan. And if you think you can get the iPhone to use without service, think again. Apple's web site says a two-year agreement is required for iPhone activation including iPod features.

* Network: Surprisingly, the iPhone does not run on a third-generation (3G) network, instead it runs on the slower EDGE network. Forbes thinks Apple opted for the slower network because AT&T's EDGE coverage spans across 13,000 cities and towns nationwide, compared with only 165 major U.S metro areas that have 3G coverage. It also brings up another excellent point. Since 3G devices are interchangeable between faster and slower networks, why did Apple still choose EDGE? Other AT&T smartphones like Samsung's BlackJack and Treo 750 run on 3G, and for what I understand AT&T is slowing moving away from EDGE. So perhaps a second- or third-generation iPhone will have 3G capability. And while the iPhone may have Wi-Fi capabilities, realistically, looking for a hotspot when you're out can be a challenge, unless you pay an extra $10 for T-Mobile access at Starbucks.

* First Generation: A geek's rule of thumb is to never get a first generation gadget. Apple is one of the few companies that revamps its products at such a quick pace, that in this case, they actually make it quite bearable to wait for the second revision. Look at all the improvements they've made on iPods and MacBooks. It may seem like waiting for a new iPhone will be an eternity, but I bet it'll be a matter of months before we see a better, faster version.

* Long Lines: I love technology as much as the next guy, but no gadget is worth standing in line days in advance for, not even the iPhone. People have already started to line up, and some are even betting real money that someone will get trampled. I would add getting shot at, beaten, mugged, and possibly being hospitalized to the list.

On top of all the above reasons, there's still some doubts about about the lack of keyboard, inability to sync with corporate internal email systems, and battery life. So lets get this straight. We're expected to pay for an overpriced phone, an expensive service plan, sign a new two-year contract, and still wait in line hoping to get one? No thanks

[Trump]

I also don't understand why you have to buy the iPhone at full price, and still sign a two-year contract.

Because people will do it.

[Enders Shadow]

Because people will do it.
I was walking to a store and I saw a huge crowd at the at&t store. My first thought was, "Man, that reminds me of the ps3... I wonder what's going on there." Then I remembered the iPhone came out that day. I wonder if people camped out all night like they did for the ps3. It may just be the same people.

[Citizen]

People just love useless gadgets that do things they don't need to be able to do. Apple could sell turds if they made them play MP3s and send text messages.

A normal cellphone is all I'll ever need. Fuck cameras, text messages, internet and all of the other useless crap people seem to think they need on their phones these days. That's my #1 reason for not getting an iPhone. #2 being the outrageous price for such a piece of worthless junk.

[Eddie Echoplex]

People just love useless gadgets that do things they don't need to be able to do. Apple could sell turds if they made them play MP3s and send text messages.

A normal cellphone is all I'll ever need. Fuck cameras, text messages, internet and all of the other useless crap people seem to think they need on their phones these days. That's my #1 reason for not getting an iPhone. #2 being the outrageous price for such a piece of worthless junk.

Well, a camera would be nice, and the text is sometimes useful, other than that, I don't need an MP3 player, I already own an iPod.

Oh, and here's the link (http://tech.yahoo.com/blogs/hughes/14081).

[kilreli]

you had me at $500
:mario:

[stsparky]

Dude: Everyone with an iPhone left the store happy. Get a grip.
http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/RDM.Tech.Q2.07/244A57B2-B535-4146-A5C4-F3804E4187A4_files/droppedImage.png
To rebute -
1. Price/Storage: Better than all the other so-called Smart-Phones on the market. And to quote Yahoo's bitter grapes article link (http://tech.yahoo.com/blogs/null/31534;_ylt=Au6ecvSYR4ICH7Czvkv47yfxLJA5): “... Putting it all together, designing a comparable plan to iPhone's $60 service on AT&T with a non-iPhone device would actually cost about $70 a month. Believe it or not, iPhone service is actually a bargain! ...”
2. Plans: AT&T bent over to be Apple's partner when the other phone companies said no.
3. Network: Surprisingly, EDGE is 3G in most of Los Angeles now. As per the AT&T Coverage Map. And it will get better as the network grows.
4. First Generation: Clearly you chose to ignore the Newton's advanced Telephony feature set from 15 years ago - but it is the 6th Generation iPod.
5. Long Lines: Everyone in line had a ball. And many a hookup was made.
AT&T's Coverage map 3G EDGE is blue. (http://www.wireless.att.com/coverageviewer/)
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1079/689671569_28f51cdf83.jpg

What the haters miss is the obvious. In most countries (Japan is an exception) - the cell phone is created for the cell phone service providers not the consumer. The iPhone has been designed for the consumer. Before the iPod was in the MP3 player market - we were all at the mercy of bad hardware makers with poor ass sound quality. To further paraphrase Dan Erin (http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/RDM.Tech.Q2.07/73805E44-AEF4-4F7F-BEF4-C759574D1D09.html):
Instead of delivering the iPhone as a $750-900 phone like Nokia's N95, Sony's P990, or HTC's TyTN, and then artificially discounting it by hundreds of dollars when tied to an expensive service plan, Apple discounted the price of the iPhone up front. Anyone who thinks that the iPhone can be sold at an iPod-like profit when it is only $150 more than the top end iPod hasn't given much thought to how much the iPhone's hardware actually costs. ... the iPhone delivers more than $454 worth of popular third party Windows Mobile software. It also delivers features Windows Mobile users can't buy at any price. But it will also offer additional software that will never make it to Windows Mobile, simply because there is no good reason to write it. ...For all the stink raised about Apple's vendor lock-in on iTunes, none of the wags seem to have stumbled onto the fact that the iPhone will be a far more effective trap. ... Once users get accustomed to a full handheld computer that works intelligently, are they going to make any attempt to break free and grab a smartphone that really does very little, like the Motorola Q? ... Other hardware makers will find it hard to match Apple's product. Sure, Nokia, Sony, and others can make fancier phones with features the iPhone lacks, whether its a 6 MP camera, a GPS unit, WiMax, an FM radio, or a cheese slicer, but the real trick to engineering is to know what to leave out. ... None of the major manufacturers have been able to deliver a competitive threat to the iPod, how much more stymied will they be in delivering an iPod with phone features, a touchscreen browser, and an extensible software platform, all at an attractive price?

So - my wife is getting one this week. And I'll have mine by my birthday month's end. And I'll mock those of you swallowed the orchestrated anti-iPhone hype.

[Plekto]

1: As said before, the price of the plan.
2: 3g? They're ready to run 4g in Europe and this thing's not even 3G?
3: Looks fragile. My phone gets the crud stomped out of it.
4: Sheep. I don't like peer pressure or being a sheep.
5: Can't get it unbranded.

[stsparky]

1: As said before, the price of the plan.
2: 3g? They're ready to run 4g in Europe and this thing's not even 3G?
3: Looks fragile. My phone gets the crud stomped out of it.
4: Sheep. I don't like peer pressure or being a sheep.
5: Can't get it unbranded.
1. The plan is competitive. Even Yahoo says so. :duh:
2. BS, the upper edge of EDGE is technically considered by the ITU telephony standards organization to be 3G service. Engadget is now admitting that yes, the top end of EDGE really is defined as a 3G level of service by the ITU. And you'd be offering your first born for a 4G phone. And EVDO isn't much faster.
3. Phone is pretty rugged. See here (http://www.pcworld.com/video/id,545-page,1-bid,0/video.html).
4. You see sheep - I see sour grapes.
5. Do you mean unlocked? It's tied to the AT&T improved network so - until the other companies are ready to provide it - AT&T pwned their competition! Do you have any idea how much an unlocked smart phone costs? The Q (http://www.simoncells.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=2174&mtc=froogle) runs $899 unlocked. When I got my SE 910i - they were asking $1200. So you have me confused.

http://www.geekculture.com/joyoftech/joyimages/979.gif

[Mastiker]

1. The plan is competitive. Even Yahoo says so. :duh:
2. BS, the upper edge of EDGE is technically considered by the ITU telephony standards organization to be 3G service. Engadget is now admitting that yes, the top end of EDGE really is defined as a 3G level of service by the ITU. And you'd be offering your first born for a 4G phone. And EVDO isn't much faster.
3. Phone is pretty rugged. See here (http://www.pcworld.com/video/id,545-page,1-bid,0/video.html).
4. You see sheep - I see sour grapes.
5. Do you mean unlocked? It's tied to the AT&T improved network so - until the other companies are ready to provide it - AT&T pwned their competition! Do you have any idea how much an unlocked smart phone costs? The Q (http://www.simoncells.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=2174&mtc=froogle) runs $899 unlocked. When I got my SE 910i - they were asking $1200. So you have me confused.


(Took out the comic, but it made me giggle. Especially the "BTW it's 'chips' not fries!" shirt XD)

Jeez. If it weren't for the fact that I have a strong distaste towards "gadgetry" and cell phones in general, you would have pretty much convinced me to go out and buy an iPhone first chance I get O.o;;

But really... no amount of convincing will make me get one. I just... don't see a need for it. I know they're hella useful but... meh. I can make do without one, and don't see what the big deal is.

That being said... the iPhone is preeeettyyy *drools*

[whispering]

If i had the money i would rather get Nokia's E90 communicator.

Anyway whats those locked phones people talk about? I mean we only recently got some deals where you get a phone with the service provider, so that you have to use that service provider for 2 years. But i've never heard of any phones being locked, why would anyone want a cribbled phone o_O

[Trump]

If you like gadgets and toys why not get one?

Personally, I have a cell phone and pay only $40 a month (including taxes) with all the standard features (voice mail, unlimited long distance, etc). There is no way I would push that up to $70 for some features I would never use. (I know they say $60, but you have to add at least $10 in taxes). I don't use an MP3 player often enough to make it worth it. But that's just me.

I suggest you don't buy it because it says "Apple" and everyone says it is "so awesome". Buy it because you would use it and you will get your moneys worth.

[stsparky]

If i had the money i would rather get Nokia's E90 communicator. Anyway whats those locked phones people talk about? I mean we only recently got some deals where you get a phone with the service provider, so that you have to use that service provider for 2 years. But i've never heard of any phones being locked, why would anyone want a cribbled phone o_O

Curious as to why? In the States - One unlocked from a reliable source is $979.95
http://i.expansys.com/i/b/b146173.jpg
vs.
http://www.ioffer.com/img/item/246/236/72/iphone.jpg

Locked Phones

“Locked!” What does that mean? The heart of the GSM phones is a device known as the Subscriber Identity Module (SIM) card. This card contains, among other things, subscriber details, security information and memory. Service providers lock the cell phones SIM card so that customers cannot go to another service provider. If that other operator inserts a different SIM card the cell phone will not accept it and the phone will not work.
Many of the new GSM handsets are actually locked from the manufacturers who sell the same type of handset to different operators. If you buy a phone from one operator you may not be able to use it if you switch to a competing cellular service provider. Additionally you will probably be asked to pay a charge if you request that the phone be “unlocked.”
Although you may buy a phone that is unlocked from independent outlets, you will find that the prices are much higher than those of the cellular service providers who tend to offer their handsets at low prices in order to attract long term customers.

So - yeah. If you want a simple phone - get a disposable Nokia. And a month to month contract.

[Knife-Fingered Sue Sanderson]

Won't the screen get really greasy after awhile?

[stsparky]

Won't the screen get really greasy after awhile?
You wipe it clean. It's pretty easy.

[MeneerDijk]

I think the I-phone is a nice piece of kit, but i think it's a bit overhyped. For months there already were rumours buzzing about it all over the internet. And not just when some official press-release had some actual info. Every John, Dick and Mary posted about some kind of rumour, wich in turn created more rumours and so on and so forth.

So yeah, I guess you could say i'm already sick of the damn thing. And even more peeved because i can't afford one D:

[Knife-Fingered Sue Sanderson]

You wipe it clean. It's pretty easy.


Yeah, but I'm a compulsive screen cleaner - my windshield, glasses, phone, TV, Computer...I think the iPhone would drive me nuts

[Hatsumomo]

I want one, but can't really afford it. A Razor is my second choice and more in my price range. Plus, my cell phone service carries them. But I think my mom is unhappy with our service and may change since now our previous two-year agreement is up and she's making noises about getting us iPhones.

[Jetsetlemming]

I've got a cheap nice cell phone that's worth maybe $50 (though I got it for free cause my little brother gave it to me :P) that does most cool cell phone things (the one feature it's missing I wish it had was a camera :|). I use my mom's 2 GB MP3 player frequently, which itself is worth maybe $50 (but also was gotten for free as some sort of "employee of the month" bonus thing from her work). I spent at max $10 a month for my prepaid plan t-mobile phone.
For a fifth of the price of the hardware and a sixth of the plan, I've got all the features I could ever want in mobile hardware. Fuck the iPhone.

[Plekto]

Although you may buy a phone that is unlocked from independent outlets, you will find that the prices are much higher than those of the cellular service providers who tend to offer their handsets at low prices in order to attract long term customers.
***
And that's the rub - it's a really expensive device. For that money, I can get most other unlocked multimedia phones(some are even capable of running Windows!). I have a Nokia 6630 myself. It's unbranded, 3g, and quad mode(will run in Japan as well!). Best $259 I've sent in years(its about two years old now). Also is bluetooth, so I can use it as a portable modem on anyone's network.

Imagine if you bought a laptop. Paid $700 for it. And could only use it plugged into a wall. You'd feel like you paid a lot of money for something that came crippled out of the box.

And for those of us who travel a lot, locked means "brick" outside of the U.S.

[stsparky]

Ah - I'm luckier than you I think. I have a SE 910i that's 4 year old that cost me $100 on a cheap monthly contract that maxed at $49. And as it was unlocked I didn't have to fuck with their bogus data plan. And as I'm not stupid enough to pay outrageous roaming charges in Japan - I simply use a Docomo rental there.

Now my SE has 4 gig Memory and can play movies just fine. But it's limited by the Symbian OS, and that gives me pause. Who'd want Windows on their phone? It's bad enough on a computer. Really. And I betcha the internet is faster on the iPhone than on your phone here in Los Angeles. It's no contest if WiFi is available.

Off to dinner. - Sparky

[Zugzwang]

You're pretty stuck on the iPhone, aren't you?

That picture was hilarious, by the way.

[stsparky]

I think it's an indicator of good things to come from Apple. And I've used the other phones, they aren't close. Wait until you get your hands on one. It's pretty much awesome on all levels.

So to recap. In most of Los Angeles - the network will default to a 3G one. The plan for the phone is competitive. It's a 6th Gen iPod that has a phone as part of it's kit. And pretty much anyone who is patient will be able to get one before I get mine at the end of the month.

[Soli]

I'd be too afraid I'd break it by dropping it or something. =/ Waaaay too much money. Same reason I don't want a new clarinet, that's around a thousand dollars- I wouldn't want to get it smudged up and would never touch it!

[Eddie Echoplex]

Yeah, the one thing to do is to wait for the second generation.

Seeing as the iPhone hasn't reached other countries, can it be unlocked so you can put the chip from your country?.

[stsparky]

Yeah, the one thing to do is to wait for the second generation. Seeing as the iPhone hasn't reached other countries, can it be unlocked so you can put the chip from your country?.
Next gen? There maybe a way to do it - but I haven't heard of it being cracked just yet.

[stsparky]

Newsmaker: Straight dope from Fake Steve Jobs (http://news.com.com/2008-1041_3-6194642.html?part=rss&tag=2547-1_3-0-5&subj=news) -> Secret Diary of Steve Jobs (http://fakesteve.blogspot.com/) -> Who Matters Now? - Fake Steve Jobs (http://money.cnn.com/galleries/2007/biz2/0706/gallery.peoplewhomatter.biz2/41.html)

...
Q: I'm curious as to your take on how the iPhone is being received by the public and the media so far.
Fake Steve Jobs: Well, I'm glad to see the iPhone getting the acclaim it deserves. The world changed on Friday and I'm really proud of the work we've done. I think it just shows that the public is a lot smarter than we often think. They know quality when they see it. When all those people lined up for a product that they didn't need to line up for, I think that spoke volumes about the kind of people we're reaching out to with the iPhone. And when I saw photos of Mexicans climbing the fence to get into the U.S. and buy iPhones over the weekend, well, I'll be honest, I cried.

So, AT&T? I mean, seriously. AT&T?
Fake Steve: Yeah. Agreed. I know. And look how they've (messed) it all up already, just in the first three days. F-----g frigtards. You wouldn't believe the phone calls I've been having with those idiots. Well, maybe you would. I called that jackass CEO, got his receptionist, and she asked me what I was calling about. I told her the iPhone, and she told me I had to dial a different number, 800 something or other. I'm like, lady, I'm f-----g Steve Jobs, and she says, "Sir, I don't care who you're f-----g, you can't just call up and get our CEO." Unreal.
...

Why the iPhone wound up invented here (http://news.com.com/8301-10784_3-9738972-7.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1_3-0-5)

[Trump]

Previous phones with "browsers" could only go to pages set up for them right? Is the iPhone any different or can they go to any page? Regardless, I can't surf on anything that small so it doesn't matter to me, I'm just curious.

[PopCulturePooka]

While I love my Sony Ericsson k800i (has a 3megapixel camera taht I use way more than I ever thought I would), I simply can not WAIT to get an iPhone when they drop in Australia... next year >.>

[Jetsetlemming]

Does the iPhone have a camera?

[darighaz]

2megpixel one


Heres why i wont buy one - I use a phone to talk... thats about it really.

[Wizdom]

2megpixel one


Heres why i wont buy one - I use a phone to talk... thats about it really.


CO-Mutha frikkin SIGN!


In this day in age who says you have to have one item to do everything...

I believe there is a old saying.. Jack of all trades.. Master of none.

Its not the price of the iphone or the service plan that bothers me (altho they are very high). Its the functionality of it.

I read somewhere that when iphone isnt on. It's a 6 step process to make a phone call. Strike one.

The touch screen keypad is a pain to type and the screen gets greasy and dirty easy.. Not a problem you say?. Keep it clean you say?.. how many times you drop your ordinary cellphone? Hell how many reports have we heard of people dropping their wii-motes? TONs.. I just waiting to hear about mass people dropping their phone a lot and breaking it because its slippery.
Strike two.

according to apple. iphone can be re-charged 400-500 times then you have to send your phone in to have its battery replaced. Stirke three! imagine being without your phone for a few weeks!!

Really tho i could go on and on. But the point of the matter is i-phone is a gimmack. It can't do any one thing great. Not a camera ( 2 mega-pixels is shameful), not internet/email ( edge network), not even mp3 player(i-tunes.. i not even going to start on that topic).. but most importantly . its not even a good phone..

Ive been saying for a long time now that phone accessories are a fad. if i want a handheld game id get a gameboy or psp. Playing a game on your phone is weak. If i wanted a camera id buy one. There are many better/ smaller/ cheaper cameras thats offered than on your phone. Its all part of the " Do every-thing on one device crap"

I'm not knocking Apples hustle. but I know a bad deal when I see one.
Its funny tho. some people are such apple-nut huggers that they will buy anything apple makes just because its apple.

[PopCulturePooka]

You obviously didn't watch the video where the guys threw their iphone onto concrete NUMEROUS times and it didn't break.

Regarding multi function, I like going out with a wallet, keys and a phone.

On that phone, with its two gig card and 3 mp camera I can listen to music, text friends, play some sudoku or vertical scrolling shooter, do calls and snap of pictures should the mood strike me and something interesting happen.

Two pockets. All it takes.

Compared to doing all those things with 1 device for each.

I'd need... a PSP, a camera, a phone and an mp3 player.

Lots of weight, lots of pockets.

No deal.

If, IF I'm going somewhere with my bag I might take one or two other things, but for most trips, a phone with lots of convergence just rocks out.

[stsparky]

It being the easiest phone to talk on is the best feature. I really enjoy using it as a phone.

When I get mine I'll do a personal OP9 review.

[Trump]

For talking on the phone I still think flip phones will give you better sound quality since you can get the microphone closer to the source (your mouth).

[Jetsetlemming]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/07/04/iphone_hack/

[whispering]

Curious as to why? In the States - One unlocked from a reliable source is $979.95
It costs about 800€ here, they dont sell locked phones here. Anyway, the phone is awesome, it has pretty much everything you can pack to a device as small as it is. Internet, email, camera, mp3 player, GPS, some games etc

[Digital Masta]

It being the easiest phone to talk on is the best feature. I really enjoy using it as a phone.

When I get mine I'll do a personal OP9 review.


Except for the fact that I only talk on the phone and as such don't need all the other crap, so I won't be getting one.

Question sparky...do you really not like windows that much? I mean I'm of the "I'd use both if I had use for Mac" faith, for instance...that 8 core Mac...I'd get it once a completely stable version of boot camp came out and run both.

[stsparky]

Jetsetlemming - I know about DVDjon's hack - more would be needed. The Register is famous for being in the pocket of those happy to spread BS. They thought the Zune would be the iPod Killer. Go here instead: Unlocking the iPhone: The GSM SIM and Activation (http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/RDM.Tech.Q3.07/3D7F6BE5-9749-4E41-848D-523BEA6F660F.html)
It costs about 800€ here, they dont sell locked phones here. Anyway, the phone is awesome, it has pretty much everything you can pack to a device as small as it is. Internet, email, camera, mp3 player, GPS, some games etc
$ 1,087.76 is quite a lot of money. Almost twice that of an iPhone really. I'd track down an old reliable p910i and invest in a decent GPS program for it: TomTom MOBILE 5 20 channel GPS kit for Sony Ericsson P910i seems to sell for £ 15 so I'm sure you can find it in Europe.
Except for the fact that I only talk on the phone and as such don't need all the other crap, so I won't be getting one. Question Sparky...do you really not like windows that much? I mean I'm of the "I'd use both if I had use for Mac" faith, for instance...that 8 core Mac...I'd get it once a completely stable version of boot camp came out and run both.
I really don't like Windows. I see no use for it. If a stripped clean bare bones version of it simply was used as an invisible OS in game platforms - I'd like it a little more. I self-taught myself UNIX from using a Sagebrook 6800 card in my Apple IIe back in the early 80s. And last night, I had to help my mother delete a file that kept on reappearing for her. I think now that my dad uses a black MacBook with Parallels on it to run AutoCad - she'll turn her XP-running POS in for a white MacBook. It isn't just about where I work now for me. In the early 90s, I was at Symantec as one of their anti-virus guys. Then I think the ratio was 9000+ PC viruses to 1 Mac Trojan Horse attack per week; And all those became useless once Apple debuted OSX. I've designed games on the Apple II, and used high end graphics stand alone workstations. I've used totally sweet PCs we had UNIX on. When I worked in Windows environments - getting to do actual work seemed to be labor intensive.

My take is this:
I can run the latest Mac OS on Macs that are 6 years old and get work done. I couldn't run Vista on the 3 year old Sony Vaio — that was the one out of three we could get to work — that my dad used before I got him a very reliable Fujitsu notebook. And as he is left-handed, he found he likes using his MacBook better. I'd cite that the application and user interfaces on Macs make the learning curve easier on those who switch. I love my mom who I've struggled to teach DOS to long before many of you were born, but I know in her heart of hearts that she is a Luddite. She prefers the typewriter she mastered ages ago. It's kinda funny to me that my brother-in-law and 18 year old niece are going to be the last hold-outs as my sister and her youngest are now using Macs.

What I find sad is when Haters use FUD (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear%2C_uncertainty_and_doubt) attacks to scare people. As to Bootcamp - it's beta and Apple simply provides it without support to help transition new switchers. Business users are recommended Parallels to use as an alternative. Leopard is designed to better solve what those are used for though. Expect the awesome.

[Eddie Echoplex]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/07/04/iphone_hack/


Yes, but I need a phone, I already own an iPod.

[Ceirnian]

Why are people even posting "Well I don't care about all these features in a phone, it's a waste."? No shit if you don't want all those features it will be a waste of money for you.

I don't want to buy an iphone either but I have to admit it looks like a damn cool phone. It's annoying when people hate on things just for the hell of it.

[ミュー]

My DoCoMo keitai could whoop that pansy-ass iPhone in a brawl, with it's right-left 3.2MP 2GB orange can o' whoopass. Beyond that, PDA phones are such yuppie fodder... no one that owns one actually *needs* any of that shit.

[Jetsetlemming]

Jetsetlemming - I know about DVDjon's hack - more would be needed. The Register is famous for being in the pocket of those happy to spread BS. They thought the Zune would be the iPod Killer. Go here instead: Unlocking the iPhone: The GSM SIM and Activation (http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/RDM.Tech.Q3.07/3D7F6BE5-9749-4E41-848D-523BEA6F660F.html)

Not like I'd ever buy an iPhone, sparky, my mental limit on how much is a reasonable amount of money to spend on a phone is about a tenth the cost of an iPhone. :3 If I had $500, it'd be going to a workable used car or computer parts. Not some ultra-fancy crap. Needs come before wants, and I'm short on funds. :P I just thought it was an interesting subject relevant to the thread. :3

[stsparky]

My current phone still rocks -
http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/yhst-28553301169418_1957_8783747.jpeg
Sony Ericsson Symbian OS smartphone, the P910i provides a complete offering of phone, PDA, email and web browsing for users on the move. It supports several mobile email providers for gaining access to and handling email remotely. Text input methods on the P910i range from keyboard strokes and handwriting recognition to T9 predictive text. The phone’s internal memory is 64Mb and it can support up to a 4Gb Memory Stick Duo Pro.
- but it is old and WAP is silly nonsense. Browsing is slow. Even in optimal conditions.
————
The iPhone movie handling is so much cleaner - getting movies on the above was a hassle for hours. The phone itself is a good piece of tech. And the way it handles PDFs is sweet. Phones should not be replacements for notebook computers.
... If I had $500, it'd be going to a workable used car or computer parts. Not some ultra-fancy crap. Needs come before wants, and I'm short on funds. ...
Just so you know the Register is ALWAYS running around with a full diaper. And things change - you won't always be short of funds.

Here's the New York Times' David Pogue:
I'll Get An iPhone! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vniMR6Ez9cE)

[Digital Masta]

Jetsetlemming - I know about DVDjon's hack - more would be needed. The Register is famous for being in the pocket of those happy to spread BS. They thought the Zune would be the iPod Killer. Go here instead: Unlocking the iPhone: The GSM SIM and Activation (http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/RDM.Tech.Q3.07/3D7F6BE5-9749-4E41-848D-523BEA6F660F.html)

$ 1,087.76 is quite a lot of money. Almost twice that of an iPhone really. I'd track down an old reliable p910i and invest in a decent GPS program for it: TomTom MOBILE 5 20 channel GPS kit for Sony Ericsson P910i seems to sell for £ 15 so I'm sure you can find it in Europe.

I really don't like Windows. I see no use for it. If a stripped clean bare bones version of it simply was used as an invisible OS in game platforms - I'd like it a little more. I self-taught myself UNIX from using a Sagebrook 6800 card in my Apple IIe back in the early 80s. And last night, I had to help my mother delete a file that kept on reappearing for her. I think now that my dad uses a black MacBook with Parallels on it to run AutoCad - she'll turn her XP-running POS in for a white MacBook. It isn't just about where I work now for me. In the early 90s, I was at Symantec as one of their anti-virus guys. Then I think the ratio was 9000+ PC viruses to 1 Mac Trojan Horse attack per week; And all those became useless once Apple debuted OSX. I've designed games on the Apple II, and used high end graphics stand alone workstations. I've used totally sweet PCs we had UNIX on. When I worked in Windows environments - getting to do actual work seemed to be labor intensive.

My take is this:
I can run the latest Mac OS on Macs that are 6 years old and get work done. I couldn't run Vista on the 3 year old Sony Vaio — that was the one out of three we could get to work — that my dad used before I got him a very reliable Fujitsu notebook. And as he is left-handed, he found he likes using his MacBook better. I'd cite that the application and user interfaces on Macs make the learning curve easier on those who switch. I love my mom who I've struggled to teach DOS to long before many of you were born, but I know in her heart of hearts that she is a Luddite. She prefers the typewriter she mastered ages ago. It's kinda funny to me that my brother-in-law and 18 year old niece are going to be the last hold-outs as my sister and her youngest are now using Macs.

What I find sad is when Haters use FUD (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear%2C_uncertainty_and_doubt) attacks to scare people. As to Bootcamp - it's beta and Apple simply provides it without support to help transition new switchers. Business users are recommended Parallels to use as an alternative. Leopard is designed to better solve what those are used for though. Expect the awesome.


I've been thinking about getting a Mac as my next laptop. But the program 3D Studio Max is only for Windows and will probably always been for Windows I'll always have some tie to Windows so I'll always need a boot camp-like program. Plus there are always going to be programs that are more optimized for each OS and run better on one over the other.

[stsparky]

I've been thinking about getting a Mac as my next laptop. But the program 3D Studio Max is only for Windows and will probably always been for Windows I'll always have some tie to Windows so I'll always need a boot camp-like program. Plus there are always going to be programs that are more optimized for each OS and run better on one over the other.
Use Maya (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maya_%28software%29) instead. I would. I was at Nichimen Graphics in 1997:
“... Symbolics developed the first workstations capable of processing HDTV quality video, which enjoyed a popular following in Japan. A 3600 — with the standard black-and-white monitor — made a cameo appearance in the movie Real Genius (1985). Symbolics' Graphics Division was sold to Nichimen Trading Company (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sojitz) in the early 90s, and the S-Graphics software ported to Franz Allegro Common Lisp on SGI and PC computers running Windows NT. Today it is sold as Mirai (http://www.izware.com/mirai/) by Izware LLC, and continues to be used in major motion pictures (most famously in New Line Cinema's Lord of the Rings), video games, and military simulations. ...”
Software first, then hardware. I never warmed to SoftImage. I trained at SGI's Silicon Studios before the end.

See, all the naysayers aren't seeing what needs to be seen. The iPhone is a phone first, and the other stuff second. The iPod stuff is the full implementation of a mature 6th generation consumer device. Games will come. But for it to conquer the Business heads - that has to be on the QT. The PDA functions seem slick. And one can read a PDF in it with no strain. So it is a trojan horse attack. And most of the folks who buy the phone will see how easy Macs are - and come around to 'our' way of thinking ...

[Mastiker]

And most of the folks who buy the phone will see how easy Macs are - and come around to 'our' way of thinking ...

Yes, Macs are very much like cheap college girls after a few too many appletini's. *hugs laptop*

Haha I didn't even notice my own pun. Appletini's! Ha! Brilliant. :watson:

[stsparky]

Yes, Macs are very much like cheap college girls after a few too many appletini's. *hugs laptop* Haha I didn't even notice my own pun. Appletini's! Ha! Brilliant. :watson:
There's no helping you, is there? Go suffer. Be shunned.

[4letterwords]

I still want an I-phone. My boyfriends boss bought the entire company (only 6 people, but still) (oh and not the interns, aka my bf... damn) an i-phone... when i went to pick it up, I played with hers. It's awesome. It's awesome. It's awesome.


When I get the money, I will be getting one of these.

[Mastiker]

There's no helping you, is there? Go suffer. Be shunned.

but... I have a Mac :_(

[stsparky]

but... I have a Mac :_(
Your redemption is up to you then, go and covet an iPhone like a good happy consumer.

[Mastiker]

Your redemption is up to you then, go and covet an iPhone like a good happy consumer.

But... I find no need to have a cell phone, and I don't have the money to buy one.. :_(

[stsparky]

But... I find no need to have a cell phone, and I don't have the money to buy one.. :_(
Life will present opportunity. Remember the original iPod was priced high; And now are affordable. You're young. Coveting is free.

[Jetsetlemming]

Life will present opportunity. Remember the original iPod was priced high; And now are affordable. You're young. Coveting is free.
Anyone ever tell you you're fucking creepy, sparky?

[Mastiker]

Anyone ever tell you you're fucking creepy, sparky?

I never thought so O.o;;

Life will present opportunity. Remember the original iPod was priced high; And now are affordable. You're young. Coveting is free.

To be honest, I don't feel the need to get a cell phone. I'm always around people with cell phones, so... I can just turn to someone and say "hey... lemme make a phone call."

Or I use a pay phone.

Both of which I have no problem doing ^.^

[stsparky]

Anyone ever tell you you're fucking creepy, sparky?
Really? Why do you think that? Do I tell people not to buy a product your company makes? Do I try to steal bread from your family's table?

[Jetsetlemming]

Really? Why do you think that? Do I tell people not to buy a product your company makes? Do I try to steal bread from your family's table?
Preaching Apple like a religion, and the whole "be a good little consumer" thing. I found it funny. :P It joke! Funny, haha!

[stsparky]

Not laughing JSL. That the phone will get more affordable is a no-brainer. This is something to ponder: Dan Erin writes: Readers Write: the iPhone in Japan, Australia, and Universal 3G (http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/RDM.Tech.Q3.07/99637810-5E6C-4214-AB08-2794711212AC.html): A GSM iPhone in Japan?
“... I had earlier indicated that the existing iPhone wouldn't work in Japan because the country doesn't have GSM service. But as Will Farnham writes, “While it's true that neither AU by KDDI or NTT's DoCoMo are GSM networks, Softbank (formerly Vodafone Japan, and J-Phone before that) uses GSM.

“My current phone is a 3G Samsung-designed Vodafone 804ss, and when I was in the UK it hopped onto their network just fine, and used Cingular 2G and T-Mobile 3G towers back home when I visited. So, it is possible that the iPhone could have an existing carrier in Japan."

“Tangentially, when the iPhone was announced, even people who know nothing about the technological differences between networks here speculated, ‘it's going to be a Softbank exclusive.’ ” ...”
The iPhone will need to get smarter: “ ...
1. QR reader: Everything from business cards to advertising are barcoded in Japan. The software analyses the QR code (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QR_Code), and puts it the right area—business card data becomes a new contact, products trigger either a bookmark or optionally loads the correct website and offers to buy it for you using your linked-to-phone bank account or credit card. Scan, click to load product page, click to buy. Receipt is emailed to you, product is shipped. Barcodes are being expanded in Europe as well.
2. One-Seg TV: Requires a dedicated chip which Apple wouldn't like, but is very popular and one of the main features people look for when buying a new phone.
3. E-Cash via near-field-contact chip: a mix of hardware and software allowing you to place your phone on a reader, thumbprint your identity, and buy stuff. The chip is tiny, the software is pretty easy. Very popular, and NTT DoCoMo is aggressively pushing it. It's undergoing test runs in the USA and Europe and NTT DoCoMo has signed on a lot of telecoms onto their standard which means we may, for once, get a worldwide standard.
4. GPS: Not required but a pretty obvious and popular inclusion as location services are expanding in Japan.
5. Better screen: by the time the iPhone makes it Japan screens such as the current 800x480 top-end will be more common, as will OLED screens.
6. Removable memory and battery: It's not just used for storage, but also for swapping photos and other data. The battery of course will be used less for voice and more for other features, so a removable one may not be required but it seems likely.

“Regardless, Apple will have to be aggressive on the software and hardware front to hit 10 million units.”

I'd never heard of mobile barcoding, but suddenly I feel like I need it. Does the iPhone need anything apart from some Delicious Library-like camera software in order to support this kind of feature? A CueCat in your pocket! http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a8/WikiQR.png...”

[whispering]

I think now that my dad uses a black MacBook with Parallels on it to run AutoCad

You can run AutoCad on a mac? :eyepop: Anyway i've been trying to convert myself to a Linux user, Ubuntu Linux (http://www.ubuntu.com) with BricsCad (http://www.bricscad.com) and OpenOffice (http://www.openoffice.org) and id save myself about 5500 euros in software costs.

[Kfisher]

http://www.solidsender.com/dstrbo/news/iprod.gif

[Digital Masta]

Use Maya (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maya_%28software%29) instead. I would. I was at Nichimen Graphics in 1997:
“... Symbolics developed the first workstations capable of processing HDTV quality video, which enjoyed a popular following in Japan. A 3600 — with the standard black-and-white monitor — made a cameo appearance in the movie Real Genius (1985). Symbolics' Graphics Division was sold to Nichimen Trading Company (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sojitz) in the early 90s, and the S-Graphics software ported to Franz Allegro Common Lisp on SGI and PC computers running Windows NT. Today it is sold as Mirai (http://www.izware.com/mirai/) by Izware LLC, and continues to be used in major motion pictures (most famously in New Line Cinema's Lord of the Rings), video games, and military simulations. ...”
Software first, then hardware. I never warmed to SoftImage. I trained at SGI's Silicon Studios before the end.

See, all the naysayers aren't seeing what needs to be seen. The iPhone is a phone first, and the other stuff second. The iPod stuff is the full implementation of a mature 6th generation consumer device. Games will come. But for it to conquer the Business heads - that has to be on the QT. The PDA functions seem slick. And one can read a PDF in it with no strain. So it is a trojan horse attack. And most of the folks who buy the phone will see how easy Macs are - and come around to 'our' way of thinking ...

I actually like Max more than Maya...but in the end they are going to get closer and closer to each other seeing as Autodesk is a software grabbing whore...although when I have time and money to get a new desktop I'll train myself on Maya @ somepoint.

But I digress.

[ミュー]

Why does everyone suppose Apple computer owners to want other Apple devices? I bought the 2G iPod, but they just got increasingly cheapened over the years. The iPhone to me looks like total fluffware. I'm buying a MacBook Pro to update my Powerbook G4, but I'll hold on the other Apple products.

[Jetsetlemming]

Why does everyone suppose Apple computer owners to want other Apple devices? I bought the 2G iPod, but they just got increasingly cheapened over the years. The iPhone to me looks like total fluffware. I'm buying a MacBook Pro to update my Powerbook G4, but I'll hold on the other Apple products.
Because Apple does its best to make apple product owners want every other apple product known to man? See: StSparky. Rabid fandom (Oh, sorry, "Consumer loyalty") = big profits.

[stsparky]

http://www.illegal-art.org/print/images/dwyerlogo.gif
Kieron Dwyer
"Consumer Whore"
Graphic, 1999

In 2000, a year after Kieron Dwyer made comic books, t-shirts, and stickers with his version of the Starbucks logo, the company sued him, obtaining an injunction that prevented Dwyer from using the parody until the case was scheduled to go to court over a year later. When the case was finally settled, Dwyer was allowed to continue displaying his logo but only in extremely limited circumstances. No more comic books, t-shirts, or stickers: he may post the image on the web but not on his own website -- nor may he link from his website to any other sites that show the parody. In short, Dwyer is permitted to use the logo as long as Starbucks can be confident that no one will see it.

It goes beyond being the brand whore you think I am. If telling you that your sour grapes and bitching is spreading FUD and taking food from my family's table is not a clue as to who I work for - then you're hopeless. And you don't deserve an iPhone ever.

[Jetsetlemming]

And you don't deserve an iPhone ever.[/FONT]
:rofl:
sparky, I'm not saying the iPhone or apple products or bad, or saying you shouldn't like them, and I'm certainly not spreading any fudd, considering I haven't actually said anything bad about the phone except it's extremely expensive to me. :P
Also, getting offended over people not liking your brand of choice is a sure sign of fanboyism. ;)

[stsparky]

You're still not getting it, are you?

Up thread someone claimed that spending $1000 plus for an unlocked Nokia brick would be better deal. He didn't say how much he expected to pay for his service plan. But the truth is that for us here in America - one could get a free crap phone with a two year plan and no text messaging for under $700. That person isn't the target market for the iPhone. You aren't either. There's reasons for this. And it isn't that you're more discerning or smart.

I'm getting the iPhone - two of them.

[Jetsetlemming]

....I'm not the target market for the iPhone because it costs more money than I have in the entire world, and even if I could afford it, cell phones, pda's, portable stuff etc. really isn't my priority in wants and needs right now. O_o Not because I'm too "stupid" or "unrefined" to like it.

[RandomPasserby]

Stsparky, you can't really translate the 800 euros from Finnish prices with the going currency rates. For example, ps3 model that costs 499 dollars in USA is 650ish euros here, a 1gb stick of corsair value select pc5400 ddr2-ram is 50.99 dollars in USA, 56 euros here in Finland (I picked the first google hit for USA price, first whole name mentioned in a local price watch list for Finland).

Also you can get really cheap serviceplans here in Finland, mine is 0,66 euros per month minimum if I don't use my phone at all and even with expensive service numbers (soda vending machines, not phone sex lines), under 30 euros (usually under 20).

[ミュー]

I'd never heard of mobile barcoding, but suddenly I feel like I need it. Does the iPhone need anything apart from some Delicious Library-like camera software in order to support this kind of feature? A CueCat in your pocket!
The QR code technology is all software, so implementing the software is as simple as having the camera app recognize then there is a borcode present and give the option to snap it and use the information. I think you can code a business card, so linking it to Address Book would be necessary. In addition, URLs are also commonly placed in QR codes so a dialog prompting the user to display, go to, or bookmark the URL would also be important.

Search "QR code" for details on how the system works and its vendors.

Hey stsparky, can I special order an MBP from the JP division with a US keyboard? I like my long ass space bar.

[stsparky]

....I'm not the target market for the iPhone because it costs more money than I have in the entire world, and even if I could afford it, cell phones, pda's, portable stuff etc. really isn't my priority in wants and needs right now. O_o Not because I'm too "stupid" or "unrefined" to like it.
No. You're the wrong demographic at the moment. Your current mood is that of Diesel Sweeties' Indy Rock Pete - who hates everything ...
http://www.dieselsweeties.com/hstrips/0/0/0/0/00002.png
That will change. What the iPhone means and does will matter later. You don't get it now. Sorry you think I think you're "stupid/unrefined" ... when it is simply that you're grumpy and without funds. Hence you're not a customer now — but later you'll feel the hook. :D

Stsparky, you can't really translate the 800 euros from Finnish prices with the going currency rates. For example, ps3 model that costs 499 dollars in USA is 650ish euros here, a 1gb stick of corsair value select pc5400 ddr2-ram is 50.99 dollars in USA, 56 euros here in Finland (I picked the first google hit for USA price, first whole name mentioned in a local price watch list for Finland). ... Also you can get really cheap service plans here in Finland, mine is 0,66 euros per month minimum if I don't use my phone at all and even with expensive service numbers (soda vending machines, not phone sex lines), under 30 euros (usually under 20).

Please - it translates to this:

800€ = $1,089.76 USD | AT&T/Apple want $600 for the 8 GB iPhone
66€ = $81.73 USD | AT&T wants $60/mo for the data plan
30€ = $40.87 USD | AT&T others gett $29 for basic plans

I sell to Finns all the time. Our computers and iPods are bargins compare to what stuff costs there. They're the ones with the language that doesn't sound Scandinavian.

[RandomPasserby]

Stsparky, it was 0,66 euros, not 66 for the minimum, 15-30 euros is my usual phone bill :P
But what I meant was that everything is usually more expensive here, so comparing the other phone's finnish price to the iphone's price in USA doesn't tell anything beyond how lucky you guys are with the prices of electronics.

[Jetsetlemming]

Stsparky, it was 0,66 euros, not 66 for the minimum, 15-30 euros is my usual phone bill :P
But what I meant was that everything is usually more expensive here, so comparing the other phone's finnish price to the iphone's price in USA doesn't tell anything beyond how lucky you guys are with the prices of electronics.
Lol EU taxes. :innocent:

[whispering]

Please - it translates to this:

800€ = $1,089.76 USD | AT&T/Apple want $600 for the 8 GB iPhone
66€ = $81.73 USD | AT&T wants $60/mo for the data plan
30€ = $40.87 USD | AT&T others gett $29 for basic plans

I sell to Finns all the time. Our computers and iPods are bargins compare to what stuff costs there. They're the ones with the language that doesn't sound Scandinavian.

You cant really compare it like that, and actually the Communicator is a business phone, where as the iPhone is a multimedia phone. But anyway, heres a simple deal you can get from one of our service providers:

A 24 month deal for the Nokia E90 Communicator with Elisa is 66,79€/month.
Which consists:
-Phone: 29€/month (you're buying it for yourself, so after the 24 months its yours)
-Phone Calls: 250 minutes 14,90€/month (extra calls are 0,09€/min)
-Text messages: 100 messages 2,99€/month (extra messages 0.08€)
-Data: 128Kb/s unlimited use 19,90€/month

With that deal you can change all the stuff. But i made one i would buy if i had to get one. Personally whatever phone i would get, i would buy it from a store with no 24 month contracts.

Anyway as for Apple, my father has been using Mac's for about 20 years. I think their really good. But with phones, i would always go with Nokia.

[Digital Masta]

I'd buy whatever works however as far as Apple products go I don't like Ipods and I don't like using Itunes I'd much rather go through my own system and drag n' drop. I have a Creative Zen M and I like it just fine.


Plus I'll also admit that I am partially biased against Ipods because everyone has one. It's not that Ipods are the best mp3 players but they are the most advertised and got a jump on everyone else.

[PopCulturePooka]

I had the same thoughts as you re: iPod's. Everyone ahs one, so I don't want one.

I had two otehr MP3 players before my ipod and got EXTREMELY annoyed at the alck of quality/interesting accesories for them. Meanwhile stores hear have whole mini departments of iPod accesories, software, speakers etc.

And I was sold.

[Digital Masta]

That's why I like Creative. They make ipod accessories as well as accesories for their own players.

[Mastiker]

iPhone Day! (http://www.superdeluxe.com/sd/contentDetail.do?id=D81F2344BF5AC7BB34BC0B21FB8767 A0FB555515999FB1DE)

Thought this would be relevant :D

[stsparky]

USA Today:Edward C. Baig: iPhone buyers have no regrets (http://www.usatoday.com/tech/wireless/phones/2007-07-12-iphone_N.htm)

http://i.usatoday.net/tech/_photos/2007/07/13/iphonex.jpg
John Mariano, 27, is surrounded by onlookers and media as he leaves the Apple Store with his iPhone Friday, June 29, 2007, at The Grove shopping center in Los Angeles.

Early iPhone owners are overwhelmingly happy with their devices, a survey out Friday says, and Apple (AAPL) and AT&T (T) are luring customers from rivals as a result.

In one of the first such studies, 90% of 200 owners said they were "extremely" or "very" satisfied with their phone. And 85% said they are "extremely" or "very" likely to recommend the device to others, says the online survey conducted and paid for by market researcher Interpret of Santa Monica, Calif. The firm surveyed 1,000 cellphone users July 6-10.

The findings are "pretty much off the charts," says Jason Kramer, Interpret's chief strategy officer.

The firm's clients are in the entertainment and mobile industries.

Kelly Croy, a seventh-grade teacher in Oak Harbor, Ohio, is a happy buyer. "Overall, the coolest device I've ever owned," he says.

Apple launched the combination cellphone, iPod music player and Internet gadget with much fanfare on June 29. AT&T is the exclusive service provider.

Greg Joswiak, Apple's vice president of worldwide marketing for the iPod and iPhone, said positive word-of-mouth reaction is "critically important" to any product, as it was with the iPod. "We're getting even greater reaction to the iPhone," he says.

Apple still faces challenges. The high cost of the two iPhone models — $499 and $599 — ranks as the No. 1 reason consumers interested in the device did not buy one, the survey says. Those consumers said they would pay an average of, at most, $180.

Owners said there's room for improvement. At the top of their wish list: longer battery life, faster Internet speed and more internal memory. Other factors, including the lack of a physical keyboard, were well down on their lists.

The iPhone is extending Apple's reach, the survey says. Three of 10 buyers were first-time Apple customers. For 40%, iPhone is their first iPod.

Apple could "change the physics in the phone market," if it is as successful building loyalty to the iPhone as it has been in the music and computer markets, says Gene Munster, senior research analyst at Piper Jaffray.

Interpret's survey also bodes well for AT&T. Half the buyers switched from another carrier. Of those, 35% paid an average $167 to break a contract. "We thought AT&T would be more of a barrier to entry," says Munster.

Another boon for AT&T: IPhone owners surveyed expect to pay about $35 more in monthly service fees compared with their previous cellphones.

Contributing: Jefferson Graham

[jindojim]

So...what can it do that my $10 Japanese cell phone can't do? Besides having a virtual keypad.

It can play music, take pictures and video, surf the web, give me train times and maps to places, let me listen to the radio and watch tv, play games, has English and Japanese settings (and a Japanese <-> English dictionary), scan kanji using the camera and translate it...and call people.

Is the iphone really that impressive?

[stsparky]

So...what can it do that my $10 Japanese cell phone can't do? Besides having a virtual keypad.

It can play music, take pictures and video, surf the web, give me train times and maps to places, let me listen to the radio and watch tv, play games, has English and Japanese settings (and a Japanese <-> English dictionary), scan kanji using the camera and translate it...and call people.

Is the iphone really that impressive?

Not for a consumer of Japanese phones at this moment. I think I copped to that.

[stsparky]

Today rocks.

I've got an iPhone. I'm going to get the damn Potter book and not let idiots spoil it for me.

I set up a wee WiFi domain in the apartment. After I've had it for a week - I'll give you folks a review.

[Jetsetlemming]

So...what can it do that my $10 Japanese cell phone can't do? Besides having a virtual keypad.

It can play music, take pictures and video, surf the web, give me train times and maps to places, let me listen to the radio and watch tv, play games, has English and Japanese settings (and a Japanese <-> English dictionary), scan kanji using the camera and translate it...and call people.

Is the iphone really that impressive?
That is one kick-ass phone. :watson: Especially being able to read and translate japanese writing for you. Su-weet.

[Plekto]

That last feature also has me intrigued. What make and model is it?

[jindojim]

It's a Sanyo W412A serviced by au.

Actually, to be honest, the kanji scan feature is a bit buggy. You really have to focus in on the kanji using the camera, and it still often misreads it. But, when it does work, it's pretty helpful. It works better when you scan English words to translate into Japanese.

[Random]

A team of computer security consultants say they have found a flaw in Apple’s wildly popular iPhone that allows them to take control of the device.
The researchers, working for Independent Security Evaluators, a company that tests its clients’ computer security by hacking it, said that they could take control of iPhones through a WiFi connection or by tricking users into going to a Web site that contains malicious code. The hack, the first reported, allowed them to tap the wealth of personal information the phones contain.


read more (http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/23/technology/23iphone.html?_r=1&adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1185163364-1OTsRJvbylLamj17FY2wnw&oref=slogin)

pwnt, iphone!

[Plekto]

Odd, I can't find any mention on the web of that phone - can you post a URL? I'm looking for a phone, actuall,y and this seems like it moght be a cool fearute to have if it's compatible with the local providers here.

[jindojim]

Whoops, I meant w41sa, not w415a. Misread it.

http://www.sanyo-keitai.com/au/w41sa/feature/design.shtml

The network it ran on was QUALCOMM 3G CDMA. But seriously..this is one of the low end Japanese phones :bored:

[stsparky]

read more (http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/23/technology/23iphone.html?_r=1&adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1185163364-1OTsRJvbylLamj17FY2wnw&oref=slogin)

pwnt, iphone!
Apple will have a patch before the end of the week; We aren't MicroSoft. FTR I am doing this from the iPhone. :p

[ミュー]

Apple will have a patch before the end of the week; We aren't MicroSoft. FTR I am doing this from the iPhone. :p
Offtopic, but can you give me a hint as to whether there's any hope for a subcompact in the JP market? My 12" PowerBook is getting old, but I don't want to upgrade to some giant 15" behemoth D:

[stsparky]

I've heard nothing but rumors.

The iPhone itself scaled up would be a sweet TabletMac. That said those of us with old and mighty 12" PowerBooks may have to bite the bullet and get MacBooks.

The 13" MacBook was intended to replace both the iBooks and the 12" as per our PR. The wife's white MacBook is about 7x faster than my 2003 PowerBook. The screen is glossy and great to watch Japanese DVDs on. I'm hoping for a 10" MacTablet myself but don't plan to hold my breath just yet.

[xtine]

I was borrowing my boyfriend's 12" powerbook for a while since the Dell notebook I had before died (it was a 13"). At first I thought it was really small, but I got used to the size, as well as many people telling me it was a cute notebook (it was!).

Then time came that I wanted to buy my own Mac since I had saved up some considerable amount of money from work, so I got the Macbook Pro 15". I too originally thought the 15"s were too big, but now I love it! Now sometimes I think 13" is a little smaller. XD But it's great for playing the occasional game, and it's awesome when I work on my own projects (school projects, personal web programming, etc) since the widescreen allows more real estate to work with.

But I personally think you should go with the Macbook. It's much more affordable than the Pros, and you get better battery life.

[Hatsumomo]

I absolutely love my MacBook. Not to mention that Apple isn't too stingy with the student discounts (saved nearly $100 when my sister bought me an extended warranty as a graduation present and when I initially purchased the MacBook, I got a printer and a 2G iPod nano for free).

And Apple customer service beats the hell I had to deal with when I had my piece of shit Compaq Presario.

[Pierrot le Fou]

When's 10.5 coming out?

[phenyl]

October (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/06/14/amazon-offers-mac-os-x-10-5-leopard-for-pre-order/), it seems.

[Plekto]

So does that Sanyo phone actually work to translate Kanji into English? It seems to be only device like that so far *anywhere* that does that sort of thing. Oh - also, I can't find specs on it. What frequency does it use(wonder if it's compatible with any U.S. carrier)

[ミュー]

So does that Sanyo phone actually work to translate Kanji into English? It seems to be only device like that so far *anywhere* that does that sort of thing. Oh - also, I can't find specs on it. What frequency does it use(wonder if it's compatible with any U.S. carrier)
Nope, there's only a handful of Vodafone models released in 04-05 that supported US frequencies. I have a Sharp 902SH, the best model that had a fully functioning unlock flash. the 903SH was unlockable, but only to demo firmware that limited some functionability. The hardest to find is an unlocked 902SH with Japanese firmware, which I got last year. Unfortunately, Sanyo has never made a JDM phone that could be unlocked for use with overseas carriers.

[Life25Karma]

Don't know if this was mentioned, but main reason not to buy an I-Phone is simply because Cingular(AT&T) does not offer insurance on the phone.

I also heard it was buggy as hell.

[stsparky]

I gather you've not covered personal items under an insurance policy yet? Home owners have a policy available as do renters. It would be cheaper for you. The worse case scenario is filing a police report for theft and itemizing while doing your taxes.

[ミュー]

I gather you've not covered personal items under an insurance policy yet? Home owners have a policy available as do renters. It would be cheaper for you. The worse case scenario is filing a police report for theft and itemizing while doing your taxes.
I think he's talking about "whoops I dropped it in the toilet" insurance, not "oh noes someone boosted my phone out of my house" insurance.

[stsparky]

I think he's talking about "whoops I dropped it in the toilet" insurance, not "oh noes someone boosted my phone out of my house" insurance.
Oh. Then fib. If your iPhone were to go the way of the goldfish - do act as if it were stolen.

[Roxie]

And don't take it to the shop. They can tell when it's had a swim.

I have a Creative Zen M and I like it just fine.

Me too. It came with everything I wanted already on it! If the iPod had a tunning feature, then I'd think about it.

[Life25Karma]

I gather you've not covered personal items under an insurance policy yet? Home owners have a policy available as do renters. It would be cheaper for you. The worse case scenario is filing a police report for theft and itemizing while doing your taxes.

For my phone I never had to, but that is always an option.