Death Penalty

[Hatsumomo]

I thought there had been a thread about this, but I only see three pages of General Discussion and this wasn't there. If there is, sorry and delete at your will.

Anyway, what are your takes on the death penalty? Please, if you have some knowledge of it, let me know about the POVs of other countries that utilize the death penalty. I only know about the U.S. and what countries use the DP.

Me, I'm pro-DP, but I think there should be a moratorium placed right now. I'm disturbed by how many innocent men have been on death row and released in light of new evidence. I want absolute 100% proof that you did indeed rape and strangle that five-year old, not just enough to convince a jury.

I also feel that if we have the 100% undeniable proof that you did that, you should be executed in the way you murdered that person. I read far too much CrimeLibrary.com and I tend to get a bit annoyed when people bitch about the lack of humanity in the death penalty because these murder victims, there was nothing humane about their deaths. Drowning in their own blood, choking on their own vomit, strangled (having had full-blown asthma attacks, not being able to breathe is incredibly frightening; I can't imagine being strangled), brutalized in horrible ways, tortured, their mangled bodies on display, raped, etc.

Some say that by using the death penalty, we're no better than the killers themselves. I disagree. Most of us have never killed anybody previously and will probably go to our graves without doing so. People who have killed did so out of malice, because they orgasm at it, because they just like doing it, because they've a compulsion to kill, they don't want to leave witnesses from whatever other crime they're committing, among other reasons.

So yes, that's a little bit of what I think without making the post overly long.

[Mechs]

Pro-Death penalty here. I don't think they should be killed in the same way they killed though, but I do believe we should bring back either hanging, the guillotine, or firing squad. Lethal injection is just to expensive and not efficient at the job. Rope and blades are cheap and efficient

[Mysticalmelody]

I do not support the death penalty.
For those who are actually guilty, they don't deserve death. It's too easy.

As for the innocent people, being on death row doesn't always save them either. There are many people who are actually put to death before they find out their innocence because of new evidence.

No one should intentionally kill anyone for any reason (besides self-defense). The government should not be an exception to the rule. Everyone knows our judicial system is anything but perfect.

[Fermented Yeast Paste]

No on the death penalty. For one, it's incredibly expensive.

Second, one innocent man put to death is one too many.

Thirdly, even if it were cheap and "guaranteed" that the guy did it, I still wouldn't approve of the death penalty because I don't like the idea of others having the power to decide that it's right for someone to die. If it's going to be done, however, it needs to be in a humane way. Reason? These aren't feudal times anymore; we're above that.

[Jetsetlemming]

I'm pro death penalty. I unfortunately don't care enough about convicted felons' lives to protest their losing them.
Though, personally, I'd rather them be shanked by their fellow inmates than put to death by the state. >_>

[Canis Lupis]

I support the idea behind the death penalty, but not the current execution system. For one, more money is spent on death row inmates, than inmates sentenced to life in prison. This doesn't make sense to some people, but when you consider the money spent on appeals and whatever other costs that are incured, the price begins to add up.
I won't even bring up the fact that it fails as a deterrent, because that's always been the case.
As for the inhumanity of it - well, if anyone argues against it for that reason, they obviously haven't taken into account the supposed "inhumanity" of the original crime. These people aren't children - you can't send them to a corner to think about what they've done, because quite a few of them probably won't regret it. Most death row inmates have it easy, in comparison to their victims. They get a shot - their victims are rarely as lucky.
If the death penalty were more cost effective than life in prison, I would definitely support it.

[Jetsetlemming]

I'm pretty sure the biggest crime detterent isn't the executions of henious prisoners, but the state of prisons themselves. Shower rapings, shanking, gangs, racial violence...
I'd be scared to death of going to prison. I'm sure a lot of guys are. I always hate it when I hear people complain about prisoners rights. They SHOULDN'T get cable TV's and good food and be well guarded. A jail sentence in itself, of any time, should make grown men burst into tears of horror and piss themselves. THAT'S one hell of a detterent of crime.
Murders are a bit hard to deter, since most of them are done out of passion, with obviously no regard for concequence. The one's that aren't, if you're willing to kill someone knowing you'll at least become a wanted criminal, never allowed to show your face again, and likely to spend the rest of your life in prison or be executed (or shot dead when the police storm your hidey-hole), then obviously lethal injection isn't going to scare you. The only way you could come close to scaring those kinds of killers is to bring back something absolutely horrific, like drawing and quartering (This is when each of your limbs is tied to a different horse, and all four horses are spooked into running in four different directions at the same time, with you in the middle), but I really can't quite condone that. >_>

[Josh]

I agree with what Canis Lupis said.

I also like what China does, to an extent. I mean, if you are going to put someone on death row, at least use their organs to help other people.

I know that'll probably never happen in the U.S. but it certainly would make things easier.

[Jetsetlemming]

No, that'll never happen in America thanks to the Simpsons. Remember the one halloween episode where Homer got Snake's hair? :P Turned him evil! EVIL! :O

[spaik]

like drawing and quartering (This is when each of your limbs is tied to a different horse, and all four horses are spooked into running in four different directions at the same time, with you in the middle),

incorrect. wikipedia it up. being drawn and quartered is being disemboweled, then chopped into various pieces and put on display. think the end of braveheart and you'll get a good idea what being drawn and quartered is.

[Random]

aww spaik I was about to point that out:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drawing_and_quartering is the link btw

JSL is referring to the french "quartering" which is another thing entirely from 'drawing and quartering':
In France, the traditional punishment for regicide (whether attempted or completed) under the ancien régime (known in French as ecartèlement) is often described as "quartering", though it in fact has little to do with the English punishment. The process was as follows: the regicide offender would be first tortured with red-hot pincers, then the hand with which the crime was committed would be burnt with sulphur and molten lead and wax and boiling oil poured into the wounds. The quartering would be accomplished by the attachment of the victim's limbs to horses, who would then tear them away from the body. Finally, the often still-living torso would be burnt.

[4letterwords]

I say kill those who kill. We keep pussying around and sucking off murderers and serial killers, then they're just gonna keep rotting in their cells anyway.

Give me a dime and I'll buy a bullet and do it myself.

I know that'll never happen so that's why I can say it.

[Jetsetlemming]

spaik and Random: I was going by the definition that I was told on a tour of the Eastern State Penitentiary (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_State_Penitentiary) a few years ago when the tour guide was describing some of the things that went on at the prison. :box: That's one freaky ass place, btw. I visited it in the middle of the day and it was still creepy looking.

[TygressVirgo]

Some state prisons are now Gang Command Centers, and the fact that there is all kinds of brutality going on doesn't scare them.

[SlickWilly440]

I don't really care either way. But which ever is cheaper that is my motto...LOL. If it's cheaper to kill a person than letting them serve their sentence in a prison cell, so be it, as long as it's done quickly after the conviction, not waiting 15 years on deathh row and using up the taxpayers money. (If there is no shadow of a doubt that the convit did it).

If it's cheaper to hang someone or bullet to the head then the leathal injection then so be it, heck might as well film the hanging in High Definition and sell it to the public on DVD/Blue Ray/HDVD, that will show the taxpayers money it hard at work. Heck might as well install a hanging unit in the court room along with a web came giving a live feed, so as soon as the defendent is convicted its straight to Old Noosy!

[shimanotaka]

If it's cheaper to hang someone or bullet to the head then the leathal injection then so be it, heck might as well film the hanging in High Definition and sell it to the public on DVD/Blue Ray/HDVD, that will show the taxpayers money it hard at work. Heck might as well install a hanging unit in the court room along with a web came giving a live feed, so as soon as the defendent is convicted its straight to Old Noosy!
So you actually consider executions to be good entertainment?

As I see it, the most important thing is to remove the criminals from society. Once they are in prison, it doesn't matter to society what's done to them. Things on the outside won't get better or worse depending on if you kill them or let them live. So why should we stoop to their level? The only thing that is satisfied by executing a criminal, is the need for vengeance and that should have no place in a rational civilization.

Using economy as an excuse isn't really good either. If we should kill criminals because they cost money, we should do the same to old people and disabled people. Put the criminals to hard labor, I say, and make them pay for their living like the rest of us.

[SlickWilly440]

If it's cheaper to hang someone or bullet to the head then the leathal injection then so be it, heck might as well film the hanging in High Definition and sell it to the public on DVD/Blue Ray/HDVD, that will show the taxpayers money it hard at work. Heck might as well install a hanging unit in the court room along with a web came giving a live feed, so as soon as the defendent is convicted its straight to Old Noosy!

So you actually consider executions to be good entertainment?


I would call it DethOTainment or HangOTainment. Just saying that if it going to cost money to execute someone might as well profit of the convicts, so the state can break even or make a profit, which in turn lessons taxes.


As I see it, the most important thing is to remove the criminals from society. Once they are in prison, it doesn't matter to society what's done to them. Things on the outside won't get better or worse depending on if you kill them or let them live. So why should we stoop to their level? The only thing that is satisfied by executing a criminal, is the need for vengeance and that should have no place in a rational civilization.

The guilty need to be punished to set an example for the general public. It shows the consquences of what happens to those who break the law and discourages future criminals, which lessens crime. It's better to strike fear into the heart of the innocent before their purity is corrupted.


Using economy as an excuse isn't really good either. If we should kill criminals because they cost money, we should do the same to old people and disabled people.


Didn't Adolf get off on killing the disabled and elderly?(Anyway..) Convicted killers aren't the same as the disable or the elderly (unless granny caused someone else to tip the bucket, but then again she would get acquited by baking some delicious cookies). Criminals(Killers) + Economy = Death


Put the criminals to hard labor, I say, and make them pay for their living like the rest of us.

That is also a great idea because the state can make a profit off the convicted criminals to help lessen taxes. (Well the non killers anyway). They could help relieve stress off the foreign child labor. The prisoners could makes something such as shoes called "JailBait Nike's" with an adverstising slogan "Filled With Convicts Sweat, Blood & Tears In Each Stitch For EveryDay Wear"

[shimanotaka]

The guilty need to be punished to set an example for the general public. It shows the consquences of what happens to those who break the law and discourages future criminals, which lessens crime. It's better to strike fear into the heart of the innocent before their purity is corrupted.

http://zfacts.com/p/688.html
Its (the death penalty's) effectiveness as a crime detterent is doubtful.
Recent studies have not only shown that non-death penalty states typically have lower homicide rates than death penalty states, but there is actually a brutalizing effect in death penalty states.

[Kfisher]

I'm against the death penalty because I believe there are better alternatives. Like, instead of putting a guilty man to permanent sleep, why not give him the life sentence AND make him do labor. At least that way he would be of some good to society. Psychiatry and reeducation is also a good alternative.

That is also a great idea because the state can make a profit off the convicted criminals to help lessen taxes. (Well the non killers anyway). They could help relieve stress off the foreign child labor. The prisoners could makes something such as shoes called "JailBait Nike's" with an adverstising slogan "Filled With Convicts Sweat, Blood & Tears In Each Stitch For EveryDay Wear"

Lol... the humor aside, that would sound like a good idea. I'd get a pair of those if there ever were some. ;)

[Jetsetlemming]

Psychiatry and reeducation is also a good alternative.


I trust the government with killing before I'd trust them with re-education and brainwashing.

[Hatsumomo]

I trust the government with killing before I'd trust them with re-education and brainwashing.


*snort* HAHAHAHAHA!


My humor, it is dark and mirthless.

[Roxie]

I'm Anti, (I guess) cause it's not working, obviously.
I'm also for more rehabilitative incarciration...let's not release BETTER criminals, mmmkay?

[Karthak]

I'm against it. Dying lasts only a moment. Being put in an isolation cell for the rest of your life would be far more terrible and more effective as a detterent.

[pangloss]

I'm against it. Dying lasts only a moment. Being put in an isolation cell for the rest of your life would be far more terrible...

Ditto. The death penalty doesnt always satisfy the blood for blood justice that people seek. Having your freedom taken away from you for the rest of your life is a sufficent punishment in my eyes.
Freedom is part of what makes people feel human, if you behave like an animal you don't deserve to be free.

On a side note, I'm beginning to think that laws should become even more draconian and that prison conditions should be worse. To the point where inmates view death as freedom. That would be a better deterent, I think.

[RandomPasserby]

Wouldn't what slickwilly440 proposed be really close to snuff which is considered to be for only sickos?

[delen]

Ok I know this is offf-topic but when I first saw this thread title I thought it was about death penalties in MMO games.

Yes I play a lot of games. I can't help it; I love them so.

[spaik]

old school UO style full loot and stat reduction prz

[yogi]

I'm not pro death pen; because what if there innocent? You killed them wrongly.. Is the state going to kill itself now for murdering someone?

I think all criminals (murders too) should be made to farm their own food or something.. They should do physical labor all day. If they fuck up like fighting, just taser em. I doubt they would fight to often; the reason they fight all the time is theres nothing to do in prison.

[Mastiker]

The only reason I am for the death penalty is because of over crowding in jails.


Either build bigger jails, or make smaller mandatory sentances. DX

[Hatsumomo]

Well, one of the reasons for overcrowding in prisons is because of the misplaced guidelines for minor drug offenses. If you're caught with a bit of blow for your own recreation, you get like five years in prison instead of a 90-day rehab stint.

[Y.T.]

Hmm. I am pro death penalty, but only if the guilt of the individual has been established well
(confessed, overwhelming material evidence), or if the criminal himself wants it.

Otherwise, I think learning how to exploit prisoners is something the prison system has not yet learned.

Yeah. The farmwork idea is neat. The only catch is, developing that perfect tracking system... so they wouldn't be able to escape from a prison without bars...

[yogi]

I know a collar that tasers them if they leave the farm.. If you try to take it off it tasers you.

[pangloss]

I know a collar that tasers them if they leave the farm.. If you try to take it off it tasers you.

Battle Royale?:innocent:

[Mastiker]

Well, one of the reasons for overcrowding in prisons is because of the misplaced guidelines for minor drug offenses. If you're caught with a bit of blow for your own recreation, you get like five years in prison instead of a 90-day rehab stint.

That's why I added "make smaller mandatory sentances"

They don't kill that many inmates though, for the number that are on death row.

And, I think another factor to be considered with the death penalty is age; it's far cheaper to keep someone whose 60 in jail for the rest of his life, but a 24 year old might be there for a long time. DX