I'm against empowerment

[Langosta]

I just realized, I'm against the idea of one group working together and saying look how great we are, look what we can do. I think it's a common thought when it comes to some groups, the KKK talks about White Empowerment, Neo Nazis talk about Aryan empowerment. Generally we look and see these groups as racist, full of hot air, or some other negative thought.
But I recently realized it might not be their ideas I'm against, I just seem to not like the idea of empowerment. It feels wrong to me, and not just from those groups but for people who talk about gay empowerment, female empowerment, black empowerment. I don't like the idea...

I think it's dangerous pride, and it can't lead in a good direction. Now some groups were oppressed historically or still are in certain places, but they should only seek relative empowerment until they're on equal grounds with the others. I'm all for equal rights, but I'm not for empowerment.

I don't know why... I guess it's because if you're not in the group it's bad for you right. So no matter what somebody is going to think it's bad.

What do you guys think about empowerment?

[BigJDiesel20]

Well it depends on what there Message is. The Difference is that the KKK and Neo Nazi Preach White Power and White Rule. The other empowerment groups for gays, women, and Blacks aren't the same. These groups represent the weaker smaller groups that have been sometimes beaten and abused to stand up and say I’m not going to take it any more.

See there is a Difference between being empowered to Dominate (Oppress) and being empowered to defend your self (Oppressed). People try to draw parallels between these groups but if you don't look at what the group represents and what they preach then you won’t understand why they exist.

Here are two Quote form Malcolm X:

"Time is on the side of the oppressed today, it's against the oppressor. Truth is on the side of the oppressed today, it's against the oppressor. You don't need anything else. "

"I believe that there will ultimately be a clash between the oppressed and those who do the oppressing. I believe that there will be a clash between those who want freedom, justice and equality for everyone and those who want to continue the system of exploitation. I believe that there will be that kind of clash but I don't think it will be based on the color of the skin."

[Kaji]

Even then there are limits to what is healthy and what's unhealthy. In the end the guy's right, it promotes sectarianism in populations, which in the end reinforces each group's perceived need for empowerment, which just makes matters worse in the end.

[pangloss]

...The other empowerment groups for gays, women, and Blacks aren't the same. These groups represent the weaker smaller groups that have been sometimes beaten and abused to stand up and say I’m not going to take it any more."
...yes they are reactionary groups.

[pangloss]

I think it's dangerous pride, and it can't lead in a good direction. Now some groups were oppressed historically or still are in certain places, but they should only seek relative empowerment until they're on equal grounds with the others. I'm all for equal rights, but I'm not for empowerment.

you are contradicting yourself.

I don't know why... I guess it's because if you're not in the group it's bad for you right. So no matter what somebody is going to think it's bad.

no it is not.

[Kaji]

He's not contradicting himself. His point is that empowerment, in theory, is supposed to put people on an equal plane. There is no authority that can measure it in an impartial manner, however, and therefore there's no way to end it when the time comes for it to end. Furthermore, as I pointed out above, it harbors bitterness between the groups because everyone's wanting what everyone else is getting above and beyond the other groups.

[pangloss]

yes he is.
he said that he is against empowerment, then went on to say:

they should only seek relative empowerment until they're on equal grounds with the others. I'm all for equal rights, but I'm not for empowerment.

[ShadowDeth]

If you're saying it leads to racial division and false superiority, that's an issue you should take up with the individual.

If someone is going to act poorly when they come into contact with stimulus, they will do it with any sort. Religion, sex, video games, philosophy, empowerment.

There is inherently absolutely nothing wrong with a harmless concept such as "empowerment".

[CNagy]

yes he is.
he said that he is against empowerment, then went on to say:

they should only seek relative empowerment until they're on equal grounds with the others. I'm all for equal rights, but I'm not for empowerment.

He is contradicting himself, but I think it is more because he is trying to walk a politically correct line. While no one would criticise him for being against White Empowerment or Nazi Empowerment, he could definitely catch flak for being against Women Empowerment, Gay Empowerment, Black Empowerment, etc.

[Langosta]

I might've typed it a little poorly but I was trying to not to be offensive like CNagy said, if I had just started with "I'm against Female Empowerment" as my first example I think this thread would've gone down the drain.
Shadow Death, I think the main difference in the concept of empowerment is that not only does it section off each group that claims its own merits but that also power usually has a stronger negative effect than other concepts. I dunno if I worded that well.
Kaji captured my idea in better words than I did.

I should also mention that as it stands now, with my recent revelation that I'm against empowerment, I differentiate a self empowerment from mutual (mutual as in not restricted to one group) empowerment or promotion.

[pangloss]

I might've typed it a little poorly but I was trying to not to be offensive like CNagy said, if I had just started with "I'm against Female Empowerment" as my first example I think this thread would've gone down the drain.
I know you were trying to be PC but it was difficult to understand your original post.
If it was worded differently I'd agree with your theory.

I feel that way about religion.

[Monkey]

I just dislike anything that segregates parts of the population from other parts. I don't care whether it's on purpose to empower women or blacks or whatever, it's still segregating yourself.

If people stopped saying with pride "I'm a Woman!" or "I'm Black!" and instead starting saying "I'm American!" I would think that it would help things along a lot farther than trying to seperate yourself from society.

[Destiny]

I just dislike anything that segregates parts of the population from other parts. I don't care whether it's on purpose to empower women or blacks or whatever, it's still segregating yourself.

If people stopped saying with pride "I'm a Woman!" or "I'm Black!" and instead starting saying "I'm American!" I would think that it would help things along a lot farther than trying to seperate yourself from society.

Agreed. How about "I am a human being" ?

[Monkey]

Even better :D

[Xuande]

The ideas of white empowerment or male empowerment are ridiculous because whites and men, and especially white men, are already quite empowered. Not to say all whites or all men are in positions of power, but disproportionately many are.

[Klilynkun]

Empower The Squirrels

Viva La Revolution

[The Republic]

The sad thing is, we see this kind of thing every day in the world. Socialist governments (communist) are ignorant against the wealthy and intelligent/skilled. They are incapable of seeing past the notion that it is hard to sympathize with the wealthy or powerful. THerefore, the natural human jealosy/envy of those with money takes root and Yatzee! You have communism.


Another example is affrmative action. Regardless of how you look at it, it is discrimination against the majority (white males) in this country.however, people think it is just because it's ok to discriminate when it's against the majority, right? wrong. It is DISCRIMINATION noetheless. And I am sickened that our country goes by it. We would be much better off by just not requiring anyone to fill out "race idetifyers" when applying for jobs or college and going solely on qualifacation, grades, or aptitude. Sure, it's hard to side with the wealthy or powerful, but beleive it it not when you use things like affirmative action against them, it is still discrimination.

I am a white male.

Is it fair that I as a white male am not judged on the same level as, say, a hispanic male? Is it fair that I am not judged on the same level as, say a white female? Even though my qualification for, say, a job could be exactly the same as theirs, chances are I wont get the job because I am white... And male. Is this still a land of equal oppurtunity? it's really hard to say yes.

I think this issue is largely being overlooked because of what has happened in the past (ie: whites and males being in power over other groups/ females, white ensalvement of blacks, nazi movement, etc). But is it fair that I have to suffer from the wrongdoings of previous white men simply because I am a white man?

I saw once, in high school, a friend of mine (hes white) get suspended because a hispanic kid called him a "Nazi KKKer" and my friend got really offended because both his granparents died in WW2 and called the hispanic kid a "Wetback." My friend (white male) got suspended and the other student (hispanic male) didn't receive any disciplinary action. hmm...

Sry bout the long post, just needed to rant about not being accepted to UC Berkley because of the above circumstances.

[delen]

power corrupts,
therefore everyone should be weak and pure

[Cherub Rock]

I believe in the empowerment of parking lots. Chop down those rainforests. Did you know that animals would continue to survive for thousands of years if all the oxygen producing plants died overnight? And think about all the benefits. No more squeezing your SUV into spaces meant for compacts. Wide parking spaces for all.

[pangloss]

The sad thing is, we see this kind of thing every day in the world. Socialist governments (communist) are ignorant against the wealthy and intelligent/skilled. They are incapable of seeing past the notion that it is hard to sympathize with the wealthy or powerful. THerefore, the natural human jealosy/envy of those with money takes root and Yatzee! You have communism.


Another example is affrmative action. Regardless of how you look at it, it is discrimination against the majority (white males) in this country.however, people think it is just because it's ok to discriminate when it's against the majority, right? wrong. It is DISCRIMINATION noetheless. And I am sickened that our country goes by it. We would be much better off by just not requiring anyone to fill out "race idetifyers" when applying for jobs or college and going solely on qualifacation, grades, or aptitude. Sure, it's hard to side with the wealthy or powerful, but beleive it it not when you use things like affirmative action against them, it is still discrimination.

I am a white male.

Is it fair that I as a white male am not judged on the same level as, say, a hispanic male? Is it fair that I am not judged on the same level as, say a white female? Even though my qualification for, say, a job could be exactly the same as theirs, chances are I wont get the job because I am white... And male. Is this still a land of equal oppurtunity? it's really hard to say yes.

I think this issue is largely being overlooked because of what has happened in the past (ie: whites and males being in power over other groups/ females, white ensalvement of blacks, nazi movement, etc). But is it fair that I have to suffer from the wrongdoings of previous white men simply because I am a white man?

I saw once, in high school, a friend of mine (hes white) get suspended because a hispanic kid called him a "Nazi KKKer" and my friend got really offended because both his granparents died in WW2 and called the hispanic kid a "Wetback." My friend (white male) got suspended and the other student (hispanic male) didn't receive any disciplinary action. hmm...

Sry bout the long post, just needed to rant about not being accepted to UC Berkley because of the above circumstances.
:bored:
so are you going to sue?

[The Republic]

no, I cant. thats why im so pissed. if I were minoriy or female, I might be able to, but the reason im so worked up is because an injustice happened here that I cant do shit about.