How to turn a website into an asset [Archive]

Decade

03-14-2006, 04:00 AM

So I'm thinking about starting a website (and no, I wont advertise it here for shamless advertising. I havent even started it yet) and was wondering something after talking about a subject in these forums:

Although they're thieving bastards, Ebaumsworld made $1,000,000 last year (ebaum bought a $850,000 office building and a $150,000 house last year alone) and this got me wondering:

How do you make this much money off a website?

While I dont wanna make it sound like I'm doing it for purely financial gain, how can I turn a hobby I would like to do, making a website, into an asset that gives me that kind of cash? Would it be through advertising? Do I have to link to other sites? Do I have to put a paypal donation button?

How is it possible to make so much money off your website?

And yea, I was thinking about asking this to help Az out too since I remember how he needed cash to fly home this month and could always use the extra beer money.

AssButt.

03-14-2006, 04:01 AM

Just make it popular, and then sell ads.

KelliShaver

03-14-2006, 06:56 AM

Have a look at this. Chris really knows his stuff and makes obscene amounts of money doing the whoel website publishing bit.

http://www.websitepublisher.net/successful_website/

Jay

03-14-2006, 07:14 AM

Not Found
The requested URL /successful_website/ was not found on this server.

Additionally, a 404 Not Found error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request.

Backtracked the link to http://www.websitepublisher.net/ and got:

Forbidden
You don't have permission to access / on this server.

Additionally, a 404 Not Found error was encblablabla.

KelliShaver

03-14-2006, 07:29 AM

How odd... It was there yesterday, and has been up for a good long time now. Maybe he's having server issues.

Xan

03-14-2006, 07:47 AM

To make money off a website you have to have something people want to see. This is something alot of people don't realize when they first hear about "people making money with websites". They think they can just go out and make a website, and get money. Content is what it's all about. Without something that everyone wants (generaly speaking, orriginal/interesting/funny content, or a service) you dont stand a chance. A good example of a site that has something people want is this one; some others include megatokyo, homestarrunner, and livejournal. All of these sites offer content that you want and cant find anywhere else (err, or in the case of livejournal a service that's supposedly better than other places).

coming up with the content is the hardest part, without content it doesnt matter how nice your site looks or how much you really want some visitors; it's not going to work. However, if you do come up with something that people want, then all you have to do is start popping ads onto your pages. and while ads like those offered by google adsense work, they arent really where all the money is at. the money is in personal deals with the people you're going to be advertising for. let people know that you have a sucessful site that generates alot of traffic, and people will want to advertise with you. the more traffic, the more advertisers you will find, and generaly speaking, the more money they will offer you :). but an important thing to remember is not to put off your visitors with the ads (for a obvoius reasons). you're usualy best to pick just a few places to put a few ads, where they will be seen, but not bother your visitors. Another good idea, is to try and find advertisers who are advertising products related to your content, or atleast would seem to appeal to your readers; this will generate more traffic for your advertisers (good because when they make money, YOU make money) and will help maintain (possibly increase?) your traffic aswell because the readers wont be put off by random ads (V1agra anyone? :/).

... and now i've been typing for a while and i've lost my train of thought.... i hope this post will be of some use anyway... :/

edit: also, when you get a good thing going, there is some money (not alot) to be made in merchandise. :)

Crowley

03-14-2006, 09:13 AM

Here's one way:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/4585026.stm

Decade

03-14-2006, 04:11 PM

Thanks for the feedback!

Yea, content is the most important factor in making a website (why else would people come to it?) but is ad's really the only main way to make money off it?

Yea this is to help me out, but I was also hoping to give Az some ideas so that he doesnt have to penny pinch his spendings while saving for things like going home and such.

A few of you mentioned merchandise, roughly how much could people expect, getting into percentages and such, from selling merchandise such as shirts can you make? And how do you find a online retailer like the one I THINK Az has, where you never have to buy or have the shirts yourself and make profit off them?

And yes, I keep in mind that merchandise for me is a long, long, LONG distant possibility which will probably never occur.

conners

03-14-2006, 04:21 PM

Think of how much money Az could make if he simply put some google text ads in a frame across the top of the forum.

Decade

03-14-2006, 05:15 PM

I often wondered about that, but the question is whether he'd want to actually do that.

I have a feeling outpost9 wasn't created to become a source of income, but it has the damn well potential to be.

Zonehunter1

03-14-2006, 06:04 PM

Those things are a damn eyesore. Let them stay on webpages not on a forum.

Shishio

03-14-2006, 07:03 PM

Xan really hit the nail on the head, but I would also add that you should be passionate about whatever it is you're doing. If you're doing an online comic, you should be passionate about comics and your own work, if it's a site to post your writing, like this one, you should be passionate about it, etcetera.

If you're not, you will most likely only create a soulless void that has no meaning, and has been nothing but a chore to you, if you even get that far.

If you think you can whip up a site and start making a fortune right away, you will be in for a rude awakening.

tekkan

03-14-2006, 07:24 PM

Thats what you think!

Decade

03-14-2006, 09:23 PM

Truth is, I do plan on starting one with my writing (I've always been told by numerous friends I should write a book or show, but I see how often that goes down the shitter pretty quick).

Right now I got a Xanga that I update pretty regularly whenever I got a new event to talk about, but I kinda feel uneasy knowing I dont have complete copyrights to the work, that was the 1st reason I had for making my own site. If I can make a little pocket change off it, that's just an extra bonus.

Annorax

03-15-2006, 12:33 AM

I make an extra $150-200 per month off poker referral links in my forum sigs. I guess people like clicking links that give them $100 for free (http://www.instantbankroll.com/ib.asp?rc=annorax)...

Decade

08-08-2007, 03:28 AM

Micah the Great

08-08-2007, 06:38 AM

Pierrot le Fou

08-08-2007, 07:39 AM

Okay, here's a question:

Let's say I want to start a website that will rely on automatically generated pages filled with data that I'd be inputting. I want the layout to be consistent and as automatic as possible, with the database probably being an excel file or the like.

What programs/languages would I learn to make this a reality? Php? Mysql?

Also, are there any good templates for pages of this sort, or how would one go about designing one?

ETA:

This was an absolutely hilarious exchage:
Have a look at this. Chris really knows his stuff and makes obscene amounts of money doing the whoel website publishing bit.

http://www.websitepublisher.net/successful_website/
Not Found
The requested URL /successful_website/ was not found on this server.

Additionally, a 404 Not Found error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request.

Backtracked the link to http://www.websitepublisher.net/ and got:

Forbidden
You don't have permission to access / on this server.

Additionally, a 404 Not Found error was encblablabla.
How odd... It was there yesterday, and has been up for a good long time now. Maybe he's having server issues.
Clearly this Chris fellow excels at making money off websites.

mawande

08-08-2007, 01:01 PM

Good point, Pierre. Here, I'm trying to make some money off of this (and have had a few hits already from toy collectors):
Toys I have in Redmond, Washinton, U.S.A. that I'd be happy to sell! (http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/jillsylvan/ToysForSale)

Decade

08-08-2007, 02:30 PM

The problem with "starting your own business online!" is that you need a business. Most company type websites are just made for information, but later add store features when they figure out they can sell there product/service online as well. I'm doubting you have this need... otherwise you're just talking about ads and whatnot. As was mentioned... you just need a popular site... then you get gay ads.. then they give you money sometimes. Either you did extreme work and calculation to make and awesome online business... or you luckily have a popular site and can get lots of money for ads..... or, think of something amazingly stupid/brilliant.. like that site that the guy just sold tiny amount of space in pixels to companies. ...or Chocolate Rain.
Right, but what about those sites that sell shit without ever actually having to hold it THEMSELVES. Or even better, not even have to pay for stuff they choose to sell?

I THINK RedVsBlue.com does this with their shirts. They put up a store section where people can buy shirts, but they never actually HAVE them, its all done through another site that makes them per order.

I also know dattebayo (naruto fansubbing group) does this too. Although profit must not be very high in these areas, its essentially profit for not actually having to do anything except put up a store itself.

I dunno. There's obviously money to be made using computers and the internet, I just dont know how.

ミュー

08-08-2007, 02:48 PM

I make money off of people who want money-making websites, but cannot make good ones themselves. It's nice knowing code/gfx very well, because it prevents me for having to fish for riches that may or may not exist. So, who wants to buy a website? :D

Civilization Phrase III

08-08-2007, 03:01 PM

Why do some websites get bought up for a lot of money? I'll give you a hint, it's not because of their online 'stores' or 'donate' buttons. It's because of traffic. Any company that gets control of that kind of a people-flow gets free advertising on their own site, and can build brand recognition (or whatever they hell they want) off of it. Engadget, Joystiq, eBaum, etc. They're all sites that have been bought out for extreme amounts of money, because they all get a lot of traffic.

Same with YouTube. Does YouTube make a lot of money? Nope, not at all. In fact if Google wasn't behind YT now, it might've gone bankrupt after awhile, because they were losing money. I read an article discussing the financial gains and losses of that transaction. But in that case, Google wanted an asset that represented the video-uploading fad. Google Video failed massively. Google saw a site that would help them, and they bought it.

This is where the money is coming from. Websites don't make tons of cash off ads, or donations, or even online stores. Not even close unless you can get over 200,000 people per day on a regular basis. But then you have to keep in mind the amount of money it takes to even keep that site running, the cost is massive. So all that money from ads goes right back into supporting the giant that someone created.

So have a hobby website, make it good, and hope someone will buy it. Only way. How do I know so much? Because web design is my hobby, and I've been into it for over 5 years now. My biggest site only reaches about 2,000 people a day, and believe me, donations don't go anywhere. Because it doesn't have that many people, I only have to pay $150/year for hosting, and about $70/year for domains, extremely cheap. I do it for fun, and don't expect any monetary gain in it. Very definitely a loss for me, but it's enjoyable. And more healthy than gambling.

If you want me to expand on anything, I will.

Shishio

08-08-2007, 05:46 PM

I decided to necrofuck this thread because I think it's an interesting topic that can be beneficial to members here.

This thread is over a year old, I know, but I would appreciate if anyone would please list their methods of success they've had making money using the net.

I notice Az has google ads on the main page of OP9 and I THINK gaijinsmash.

How effective are these? I had it on my blog one month, but it got taken down (a friend of mine wanted to help me out and clicked on ads to often or something. I dunno, but it was something against their rules or something of the sort).

Most people will tell you Adsense is shite, (And yes, they prohibit click fraud.) but DJ Coffman (http://www.yirmumah.net) seems to have done well with it. Check out his tips (http://yirmumah.net/make_money/).

Personally, I believe the best ad system by far is Project Wonderful (http://www.projectwonderful.com). PW is unique in that it employs a competitive auction model. People bid on your ad space and the person with the highest bid gets their ad shown until they are outbid, or their ad expires. (You decide when you want ads to be shown.) PW takes 25% for providing the service. But like with any other advertising program, you will not make jack shit unless you are obscenely popular.

That said, almost everything I have read/heard says that PW is best, and everything else is shite. I am inclined to share this sentiment because PW was created by Ryan North (http://www.qwantz.com), who is one seriously awesome dude that provides a number of helpful services like Oh No Robot, (Search engine) and RSSpect. (RSS feeds made easy.)

Okay, here's a question:

Let's say I want to start a website that will rely on automatically generated pages filled with data that I'd be inputting. I want the layout to be consistent and as automatic as possible, with the database probably being an excel file or the like.

What programs/languages would I learn to make this a reality? Php? Mysql?

Also, are there any good templates for pages of this sort, or how would one go about designing one?

PHP... I think. You should ask Zachary Lewis (http://someryc.mostpopularcomic.com/forum/), another seriously awesome dude. (He was most helpful in setting up my site. I really can't stress how helpful he was enough.) Even if he can't help you, I'm sure he can point you to someone/something that can.

As for templates, there's Free Website Templates (http://www.freewebsitetemplates.com), though perhaps those are not quite what you're looking for. Simpler, easier to customize templates can be found here (http://cwcomics.comicgenesis.com/generator/css.html). I use a slightly modified version of the charcoal template.

Incidentally, if you have not already made hosting arrangements, I would very strongly recommend Dreamhost. They provide shitloads of storage and bandwidth, (Which increases every week you're with them.) unlimited subdomains and MySQL databases, one-click installs for things like Wordpress, PHPBB, Joomla, Media Wiki, and so forth.

I have not yet made any serious attempt to monetize my site, mostly because Paypal would reveal my name to anyone who sent me money, and partly because the majority of my meager audience only wants to derive pleasure from my (What other people consider) obscene sense of humour.

But I have conducted a lot of research on the subject, and at a later time, when I am more energetic and coherent, perhaps I will post what I've learned along with further thoughts of my own.

Until then, I would like to say again that Xan hit the nail on the head. What Civilization Phrase III says has a lot of truth, but it is possible to make a living, even do well for yourself through a combination of revenue models - advertising, merchandising, donations, etc. The chances of you being so lucky however, are, at present, less than winning the fucking lottery. Which is, I feel, mostly due to the internet enabling people to get entertainment for free, which results in their taking it for granted, and even making demands of people who share the things they enjoy with them for free.

But I will spare you my contempt-filled rant about that.

If you guys have any more questions, don't hesitate to ask.

Civilization Phrase III

08-08-2007, 06:22 PM

Shishio, I think your part regarding my post was confusing. You first say it's 'possible', but then say it's like winning the lottery. I think my post was very correct, and it's not good to fill the heads of n00bs with ideas of grandeur. It's easier to just tell them "No, I'm sorry, it'd be impossible for you".

And Dreamhost? Are you serious? That is a shitty host (just read their reviews sometime). You're going to get better deals off smaller hosting companies that are willing to be honest and not completely over sell. DreamHost currently offers their lowest package with an amount of space and bandwidth that would be FAAAAR from profitable. In fact, if people used as much as they were allotted, it would drive them to bankruptcy. That's not a business model I trust at all. I've been fine at Downtown Host (http://downtownhost.com), where the owner has a large presence and you can get to know the support staff.

And yeah, PLF, PHP/MySQL is the way to go. You could do it through other means, such as ASP + Access or Coldfusion and such, but PHP is as common as dirt and can help you out as far as any type of programming goes too. MySQL is nice. I likes it.

I will totally agree with people taking things for granted. People complain so much if my site doesn't get updated, or I get some piece of news wrong. They don't realize how much time I devote to keeping my site up and searching for news and making new content, etc etc. And I actually keep my site adless, and I took down the donation button with my new layout. So they're really getting a deal, because 90% of the other sites have ads on them.

Of course, I use Adblock, so I rarely see an ad...and then it's only until I right click and block it. That's another downside with AdSense now.

And I have to comment that right now, it's worth learning CSS and DIVs. Tables are pretty old now, and CSS is where things are headed. So once you're ready, I'd advise jumping into deeper waters. I just made a new layout that runs completely on CSS and DIVs, and it's fantastic~

Shishio

08-08-2007, 07:15 PM

Shishio, I think your part regarding my post was confusing. You first say it's 'possible', but then say it's like winning the lottery. I think my post was very correct, and it's not good to fill the heads of n00bs with ideas of grandeur. It's easier to just tell them "No, I'm sorry, it'd be impossible for you".

I take it you've never heard of Jerry Holkins, Mike Krahulik, Scott Ramsoomair, Ryan Sohmer, Jeph Jacques, Randy Millholland, Rich Stevens, Jon Rosenberg, DJ Coffman, et al?

(Those are all people who make their livings from webcomics. And they're not the only ones.)

Again, the odds aren't great, but it's far from impossible. The lottery comment was just a result of bitterness, it's actually becoming more likely, and will, I believe, continue to do so. There's lots of people who make their livings from webcomics, blogging, whatever, and more that are able to supplement their income.

And Dreamhost? Are you serious? That is a shitty host (just read their reviews sometime).

I've been using them since May 2006 and have only had one minor problem.

You're going to get better deals off smaller hosting companies that are willing to be honest and not completely over sell. DreamHost currently offers their lowest package with an amount of space and bandwidth that would be FAAAAR from profitable. In fact, if people used as much as they were allotted, it would drive them to bankruptcy.

They've said as much themselves, actually. But, as they went on to say, their model works because 99% of their customers only use a small amount of the storage and bandwidth they are entitled to. Given what I need, they are the best host for me.

I will totally agree with people taking things for granted. People complain so much if my site doesn't get updated, or I get some piece of news wrong. They don't realize how much time I devote to keeping my site up and searching for news and making new content, etc etc. And I actually keep my site adless, and I took down the donation button with my new layout. So they're really getting a deal, because 90% of the other sites have ads on them.

I know exactly what you mean. And of course, hardly anyone can ever be bothered to even thank you.

And I have to comment that right now, it's worth learning CSS and DIVs. Tables are pretty old now, and CSS is where things are headed. So once you're ready, I'd advise jumping into deeper waters. I just made a new layout that runs completely on CSS and DIVs, and it's fantastic~

I agree with this 100%.

Civilization Phrase III

08-08-2007, 07:58 PM

I was such a nerd. Like a week ago I was so happy because I got all these cool hovering elements in, both for my menus and for other uses. But specifically getting unordered menus to fully hover within the div (block) got me stoked. Before I tried, I hadn't really done more than superficial stuff with CSS.

But honestly, it's pretty awesome.

Right now I'm looking into some practical uses of DHTML. I'm never one just to put stupid effects into things if it's not warranted. I am really not that stupid.

xtine

08-08-2007, 10:30 PM

Dreamhost is very good. I myself, including a few friends and a few famous web designers out there, recommend it.

And honestly, unless you have a "knack" for finding something that people will flock to online, you will honestly get more out of a minimum wage job than getting some money online.

Basically, there are three common ways to make money. There's the straight vampire route. You can try to register dozens and hundreds of domain names you'd think someone would want that isn't taken, and cybersquat. Or make tons of fluff pages, googlebomb, advertisements, etc. It makes some money, but people online will hate you. But many do it.

If you are business minded, start a company. Open an eBay store, resell stuff, start a company. Sites like Gaia Online, Youtube, Digg, Facebook/Myspace make no actual money from their site. How do they have tons of cash? Venture capitalists that choose to invest. They throw millions of dollars at them in case they make it big, in which they give back a bit of the profits. However, making a start-up is rather difficult, and you need to know top-notch programmer friends (except for Myspace, that site is still utter crap).

And then, there's there the small way. Start a fansite, webcomic, something. Though you really have to be passionate and interested in the subject you make a site about. Say like a big site about a band, you really have to know and be involved. Then you can slowly put ads, but it's barely going to make anything. Most of these sites that make a meager profit are started out of love for a particular thing, and then realize that webhosting isn't free and try to offset those costs with ads or merchandise.

As far as backend, php/mysql is the most popular. However, if you can't program or find someone to do it for you, you can go to opensourcecms.com to find a content management system you can install yourself to manage thing, and some are flexible enough for you tinker with modules.

And of course as a web designer, I encourage anyone learning basic css to design their sites. Also, learn web standards, and you will begin to hate IE.

Radiance

08-09-2007, 04:01 AM

I'll just say this, it is extremely rare to make a living off a website alone. Generally the website is the portal to something else. Examples of this are weeblstuff, rathergood, homestarrunner, etc... While they provide original content they are more of a living portfolio of the artist's work so that they can generate more work outside of their website.

The few sites that make profit off the actual site are things like somethingawful where individuals join for the community, the articles, and other content. This is more akin to selling a magazine. Similar things are seen on porn sites where people (occasionally) pay for the actual content.

Everything else is made by advertising others and the products or services they have to offer. Now when I see mention of ebaum it makes me laugh... while he has been successful, no one can deny that, he has done it by depending on others for his content and as seen in the past this is often gained through the theft of intellectual properties and a good legal team to save him if the original author ever discovers the theft. So... with this sort of thing in mind I would tell you before you even go about making the site or what it should look like, you should focus on a business model. What is your website about and why should people visit it?

Pierrot le Fou

08-09-2007, 04:42 AM

I have a tremendous business model, it's just a matter of setting up the content so that it's easily manipulated and won't suck an hour or two out of every day to update. And THAT is going to be hard...

At any rate, is there a way to turn an excel file into a database for MySQL? I'm doing a bilingual site, and am putting translations side by side in an excel sheet currently, so it'd be easy to do with a MySQL form thingie.

I read up on PHP and the like, and figure I may as well go with wordpress, but am slightly worried about someone taking everything from my database (since a lot of the data, while not proprietary, would have taken me a LOT of time to set up, and would allow someone to start a new site of their own in a hurry).

Silverhawk

08-09-2007, 05:30 AM

At any rate, is there a way to turn an excel file into a database for MySQL? I'm doing a bilingual site, and am putting translations side by side in an excel sheet currently, so it'd be easy to do with a MySQL form thingie.
Its possible to get a PHP parser and write one that will read the excel file, and then input the data into your wordpress. That would be the ideal way to do it. However you would need to know how to write the parser, or find someone who can do it.

I read up on PHP and the like, and figure I may as well go with wordpress, but am slightly worried about someone taking everything from my database (since a lot of the data, while not proprietary, would have taken me a LOT of time to set up, and would allow someone to start a new site of their own in a hurry).
I assume you would be getting your own private hosting, so people stealing your data is next to nil unless of course you get hacked. As long as your content is public, there's really no way for you to stop people from making a copy. If they want to do it, they will. Even if it means copy/pasting your site manually.

You do have legal channels to punish them if they do that though :)

Now to Decade, the first question you have to ask yourself is this. What is your main objective?. Do you want to make money? Or do you just want to create a site for passion? The thinking process is very different, so you have to be sure what your objective is, if you want to succeed.

Pierrot le Fou

08-09-2007, 05:36 AM

When reading up on Wordpress, it said that 90% of sites that use the software are easily exploitable. I don't mind copy-pasting my data, I just don't want them to dump my database is all.

xtine

08-09-2007, 05:50 AM

Php, while a good language, has a lot of exploits as you've noticed in wordpress. The main thing is to keep up on always updating the software you use, and keep up on security updates. Database dumping would only happen if someone hacked your site, and usually fully hacking to that extent is not that common. Usually hackers just want to mess up a site, not steal their data unless it was like a bank. Unless you have very secure data (like social security #s, private matters, etc), I wouldn't worry that much about it. It is a risk you take by putting a business model online, however all businesses have their risk no matter what.

Pierrot le Fou

08-09-2007, 06:05 AM

Okay.

Also, is wordpress easily editable? Basically, I am making all of my content in both English and Japanese, with parallel structures, so it's just a matter of reading their IP to see which country/language is likely more appropriate, setting a cookie, and having the language extend that way. Additionally, I'd add a button for the opposite language in case someone who wants English is in Japan, or vice versa (which would also set the cookie).

However, I'd assume that WordPress is not set up to handle that, and that makes me a tad bit worried. I'd be dealing with a LOT of data, sortable tables and lists and the like, and the easier it is to swap between languages, the better.

xtine

08-09-2007, 06:17 AM

You should look at opensourcecms.com and you can try out other content management systems before you install. Most of them are free.
You could try Drupal, which is like wordpress, but has many extendable modules. There are many other choices that probably suit you better than wordpress, so it's a good idea to explore that site to see what's better for your need.

Wordpress is just generally suited for just a blog, and nothing else. It's hackable, but a pain because it's really just tailored to be a single purpose blog.

Pierrot le Fou

08-09-2007, 06:20 AM

I see. php just looks like any other programming language with database accessibility through mysql, and should do the job without much trouble. It's the setting up of the framework that I am worried would take me days/weeks/years to figure out. I need to find easy ways to update a database (daily) as automatically as possible, and I am well behind on that.

Just things like archiving more than X amount of posts and the like will give me headaches upon headaches methinks.

Trump

08-09-2007, 01:26 PM

I feel like people are totally missing the point. You don't just make a website to make money. You have to have something behind it. RedvsBlue, dattebayo, and web comics all produce something. They make videos, comics, translations, and they do almost all of that for free. They do it because they enjoy it and other people enjoy it. And finally, after doing it for YEARS they were able to develop the kind of following that would purchase T-shirts and other merchandise. They are making money from their intellectual property. Unless you have something to make money off of, you aren't going to make money. Decade, I think you are missing the fact that these people actually do provide a very valuable service. It is like Disney, without the first creating mouse they wouldn't have made any money from merchandise. Sure, RedvsBlue doesn't actually make the shirts, but they got people to want to buy them which is more valuable than the shirts themselves.

Decade

08-09-2007, 01:58 PM

^Obviously they all make services, but you totally missed the point as to why I mentioned them.

There are some internet businesses out there that are able to sell something without actually having the products their selling stock. I mentioned RedVsBlue and Dattebayo because they do this method of selling merchandise. They have online stores and are able to sell stuff like shirts without ever actually needing to buy a base supply first, the purchase the product they sell when they sell it.

What I'm trying to find are suppliers willing to do that with any kind of merchandise (apparently, lots of web businesses do that) to see if its still a profitable idea to pursue.

Trump

08-09-2007, 02:14 PM

The best way to think about it is to relate these web businesses to salesmen. Base supply and all that don't matter because they are just salesmen. They sell another companies product, like T-shirts or coffee mugs. They use their intellectual property (like comic characters) to help sell these things, but it really just boils down to being a salesman. Their intellectual property is that one thing that sets them apart from all of the other salesmen out there. Being a salesman will always be profitable as long as you can actually sell things and if you can sell things retailers will practically chase you down to sell their products.

Silverhawk

08-09-2007, 04:15 PM

I feel like people are totally missing the point. You don't just make a website to make money. You have to have something behind it.
You'd be surprised how many people make websites just to make money. There are plenty of link farms/aggregated content around, and the million pixel website was also made just for money.

There are some internet businesses out there that are able to sell something without actually having the products their selling stock. I mentioned RedVsBlue and Dattebayo because they do this method of selling merchandise. They have online stores and are able to sell stuff like shirts without ever actually needing to buy a base supply first, the purchase the product they sell when they sell it.

What I'm trying to find are suppliers willing to do that with any kind of merchandise (apparently, lots of web businesses do that) to see if its still a profitable idea to pursue.
The simplest method for this is just to take orders. When you've reached a certain number of orders, you get the t-shirt (or whatever other item) to be printed and send them to your buyers. Its a common business method.

There are places like cafepress where you can sell some merchandise, but they're not cheap so the profit margin on those are ridiculously small, you would need a huge following to make any sort of money.

Trump

08-13-2007, 01:46 PM

Yeah, I don't think I said it very well. I meant you don't just create a website and expect it to make money. You have to have some sort of reason for it to make money whether it is content driven, service driven, or merchandise driven.

PopCulturePooka

08-13-2007, 01:58 PM

If I were to want to make money via website, serious bank, I'd cruise colleges and bars to find 2-3 hot but dumb girls, invest in a good SLR camera and make 3 single girl sites.

1 girl for Non-nude.
1 girl for soft-core topless.
1 girl for solo girl hardcore with guest appearances from other sites.

After a year retire the ahrdcore girl, move the other two up a rank and sell it as a BIG EVENT 'CANDY'S FIRST TOPLESS PICS'.

And recruit a new NN girl.

mugen

08-13-2007, 02:01 PM

PopCulturePooka

08-13-2007, 09:01 PM

hahaha, that actually sounds like a solid plan.
My 6 - 7 digit income earning adult webmaster friends can attest to it.

Trump

08-14-2007, 01:00 PM

I really can't believe people pay that much for porn. It is sad but true.

Decade

08-14-2007, 01:58 PM

Isnt porn supposed to be one of the few billion dollar industries that never does bad or something?

Trump

08-15-2007, 01:49 PM

probably =/

Shishio

08-15-2007, 04:24 PM

I thought everyone knew that.

xtine

08-15-2007, 08:06 PM

It you aren't stupid about it, porn is definitely going to make you some big bucks, but it comes at a great social cost. While you will be raking in the dough, there will be a lot of people that will not associate with you just because of the adult industry. Family might disagree, and it's hard to keep a positive reputation.

However, I have heard that the porn and adult industry is very professional. I once saw an eBay auction of these two guys that was selling their entire (very profitable) small porn biz, including assigned lawyer, list of girls ready at call to work, network connections, the whole shebang. The guys were giving up very easy money because it simply teared apart their personal, social, and family lives.

Decade

08-15-2007, 09:34 PM

See, thats why I would use a screen name for being a director.

Dr. Johnson.

I KNOW thats original.

Civilization Phrase III

08-23-2007, 03:15 AM

I want to see how PLF is doing now. lulz.

Probably floundering in a world over his head.

Pierrot le Fou

08-23-2007, 03:25 AM

I want to see how PLF is doing now. lulz.

Probably floundering in a world over his head.
Actually, I installed MySQL, phpMyAdmin, PHP, and Wordpress, along with a bilingual plugin, and am starting to add content/build a few databases of relevant information. Next step is to finalize the localization of the menus, add content, and make the PHP script to parse the extra databases.

Over my head? Sometimes, but then I learn and make progress. The biggest pain in the arse has been trying to create the .mo file for localization, since POEdit for the Mac seems to be buggier than Hell. I may just end up doing it with GNUpress or whatever it's called, but that strikes me as being a royal pain in the arse (no GUI and no idea how to input Japanese characters through a unix shell), but it can be learned.

ETA for release of the site is March 2008, and I've already got two people in the industry the site is geared towards interested enough to have drawn out discussions and want meetings with me about it.

So I don't think I'm doing so bad for someone who's taught himself, thanks.

Civilization Phrase III

08-23-2007, 03:26 AM

Are you hosting this project on your own computer slash bought your own server?

Pierrot le Fou

08-23-2007, 03:33 AM

Hosting it on my computer so that I can set it up, see what works, and diddle with the back-end files without worries before getting a server and making the site go live.

Civilization Phrase III

08-23-2007, 03:38 AM

I have no clue in hell why you put yourself through so much effing pain there bud. I could've given you test space and bandwidth to boot if you just wanted stuff.

Except actually phpMyAdmin would need root access...but I still have a whole list of free hosts that you could've worked with.

Jeez, you are masochistic. On a Mac no less? I'm using linux right now and I wouldn't put myself through setting up shit. I still like to mess around with MySQL 5 of course though, try out some new features...

But that would be beside the point.

Silverhawk

08-23-2007, 05:19 AM

Except actually phpMyAdmin would need root access.
You only need MySQL access, you don't require root access for phpmyadmin. PLF is doing it the right way, build and test locally before making it go live. He'll then also know what the server requires to run his stuff. It sucks to get a server and then find out what you want done cannot be done because of some restriction or lack of feature.

Pierrot le Fou

08-23-2007, 06:50 AM

I'm doing it the way I'm doing it because it will force me to learn the things I will need to know to set up a server and do it the proper way. I'm doing it the way I'm doing it because I feel that if I'm going to do something, I should do it right. I'm doing it the way I'm doing it because depending on others for help will leave me dependent on their help in the future, and that doesn't appeal to me for many reasons.

Now I know I can set up MySQL, I know I can set up PHP, I know how databases work, and how to use PHP My Admin to setup and control databases, I know how to install WordPress, and the problems that can occur due to it, and most importantly, I know that I can do it all if I put my mind to it.

The way I'm doing it, I just have to get a webserver that will run the PHP and MySQL versions I have, upload my files, and presto! Fully functional no-nonsense site with a backup on my computer and no surprises.

Indeed, how else would you have me do it?

Civilization Phrase III

08-24-2007, 03:38 AM

I just don't know what kind of server you expect to buy plf~ installing MySQL and PHP really have more to do with learning how to be a nerd. In practical web design, they don't hold much place. Sure, if you want to have IT knowledge, go for it. And I dunno why you'd need phpMyAdmin if you have direct MySQL terminal access right there on your computer. phpMyAdmin allows me to go through my hosting control panel and control my databases, because it'd be impossible for me to use any sort of terminal. So it's a web based thing. Maybe you just prefer the easier GUI?

And installing Wordpress is a breeze. You'd be using FTP to upload the files most likely in any sort of bought web server. And then you just create a database and plug in the right username/password. You won't need to worry about how your server 'reacts' to it, and I can't imagine any problems that you'd have to deal with it directly related to a web installation of it.

Maybe I'm completely off base, but even if you are going to be buying a server, do you really think that is a computer you can just plug in a mess around with like your Mac? I would assume that you'll be buying something you can connect to over the internet. Even if you have a physical server to yourself, it's not like a normal computer.

Or I might be missing a huge chunk of your master plan. And if I sound like a douche for this, I apologize. It just means I don't understand what kind of hosting you'll be buying and exactly the type of mega-site you'll be building.