Firearms owners and Shooters

[Felix_the_Cat]

Thought I would make a thread about firearms and shooting (as I used to have one on the board of old).

Are there any new shooters on the board or firearms enthusiasts at all?

Those who know me, know that I am a gun nut :D

Come out of the shadows and say hello!

Sadly, the missus and I have decided that I should start selling some of my collection. I am allowed to keep 10 of my favorites. Its hard to let them go though, as after awhile, I have kind of grown attached to them.

I guess 10 will be enough for now :D as I do want to get some new furniture in here (a blender and a toaster would be a nice improvement as well)

[Firebaall]

Having 10 under the Candian Firearms Act permits surprise inspection. Consider having only 9. ;)

Here's my baby:

Savage 12VSS Varminter in .223 rem w/bushnell elite 4200 6-24x40mm mil dot, and harris 9-13 S series bipod. :D

http://img79.exs.cx/img79/4089/DSC10.jpg

http://img79.exs.cx/img79/8647/DSC00016.jpg

[RedLine]

Just as a side note question:

What is the appeal of guns. Whenever I ask why someone would need a gun, they say it is for protection. Yet, a large majority of deaths from firearms are either from kids getting a hold of a gun, suicides, or criminals and drug dealers shooting fellow criminals. Why would you need a gun to protect yourself from another human being unless you are a criminal or drug dealer? They say guns don't kill people, but people kill people. If this is true, then why arm other people if you don't want someone to kill you?

[jingi893]

count me in...i used to shoot a lot with my dad...belonged to a range and all that...unfortunately all my guns are way on the east coast... .22 rifle, luger, and an argentine mauser...i was thinking of purchasing when i moved to cali...but now that i'm going to japan i won't buy...there is a really nice gun range near my apartment and some of my friends an i go shooting...not as much as i'd like too...i generally prefer .9mm...they seem to be a good fit for me...not much kickback/noise and plenty of stopping power...though i'll shoot anything once...

[Phyphor]

Just as a side note question:

What is the appeal of guns. Whenever I ask why someone would need a gun, they say it is for protection. Yet, a large majority of deaths from firearms are either from kids getting a hold of a gun, suicides, or criminals and drug dealers shooting fellow criminals. Why would you need a gun to protect yourself from another human being unless you are a criminal or drug dealer?

Ok, so women walking down the street are either criminals or drug dealers if they use a gun to defend themselves from potential rapists?

Or a man minding his own damned business in his own home is a criminal if he defends said house from a home invader?

They say guns don't kill people, but people kill people. If this is true, then why arm other people if you don't want someone to kill you?

Uh, in case you haven't noticed, criminals don't tend to follow laws. You can take weapons from law abiding folks, but criminals ain't gonna give a fuck about one more little charge.

[Phyphor]

<- gun nut right here.

Firmly believe that it's a human right to be able to defend yourself. You ain't gonna stop the badguys from arming up, so why not be prepared?

And just for gits and shiggles, doubters can visit here. (http://www-a-human-right.com)

[Felix_the_Cat]

What is the appeal of guns. Whenever I ask why someone would need a gun, they say it is for protection. Yet, a large majority of deaths from firearms are either from kids getting a hold of a gun, suicides, or criminals and drug dealers shooting fellow criminals.

Well, first and foremost I need a gun so that I can respond to a situation where I might have to be able to defend myself or anyone around me with the appropriate amount of force.

Secondly, I own a firearm because it is my right (while I still have them) to do so. Remember, a citizen is armed while a subject is not. Your government is there to serve YOU, not for you to bend a knee to. I am not a criminal or a drug dealer, I am a free man, and if I wish to exercise my rights though purchasing a firearm I will.

Yet, a large majority of deaths from firearms are either from kids getting a hold of a gun, suicides, or criminals and drug dealers shooting fellow criminals.

This is terribly incorrect. But an easy conclusion to come to, due to the brainwashing of the media.

In Canada (I am not sure of the US stats) there were roughly 1200 firearm related deaths. 80% of these deaths were unfortunately due to suicide, 18% due to accidental discharge and 2% to violent crime. Keep in mind these are the statistics from Registered firearms owners, and do not include statistics from illegal firearms. In Canada, you must go though a long and thorough application process to be able to legally own firearms. Though this process, people who are deemed 51-50 (suicidal tendencies) are not issued a license. Unfortunately if a person is set on suicide, a stack of government forms will hardly deter them.

They say guns don't kill people, but people kill people. If this is true, then why arm other people if you don't want someone to kill you?

This brings up a few good sayings I have heard over the years. The first being “What is more dangerous, a woman who is certified to carry a firearm, or a serial killer with a clothes line”. A firearm is just a tool, and many, many, many tools in the right or wrong hands become dangerous weapons. Do you know more people are killed with shovels then firearms in Canada? Not to mention Vehicles.

A practical usage of firearms is the fact that they are a force multiplier. As mentioned by Phyphor was women. Women are (sorry ladies but its true) physically weaker then men, it’s a biological fact. Take a 115 pound woman and have her assaulted by a 200 pound male. The woman is at a serious disadvantage from a physical force standpoint. Now let’s say the woman is armed; now her physical force ability to defend herself is multiplied to the point where she can effectively defend herself from the male.

I will never understand the liberal mind frame where it is more justified and accepted to have a woman raped and strangled with her own pantyhose, then to have her explain to the police that she ventilated her assailant.

Fireball: That is one very nice looking savage. That Choate stock practically caught my eye :D. I have seen a few of those in my time and I love the feel of them, I am a fairly big guy, but it sill manages to make me look a little small:P. Good to see another Canadian owner abroad though :D Sadly with the way our government is moving, we are an endangered species.

Phyphor: I like the way you think man, you definitely have the right idea going on there.

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

[MNJetter]

That poll, my friend, is sort of like a guided interrogation - a set of questions meant, not to discover the truth or discover another person's opinion, but to make another person say exactly what you want them to say in order to prove your point without addressing the counter-arguments. Pointless.

I'm all for keeping guns for hobby's sake, and shooting at shooting ranges. Don't do it myself, but I know people have fun with it. More power to 'em.

But the whole defending yourself with a weapon thing is stupid, right now. You may feel safer, but statistically, if you own a firearm and your house is broken into or you are attacked, you are far more likely to a) shoot yourself, b) shoot a family member by accident, or c) not have time/the means to get your weapon than you actually are to defend yourself. Only one in a hundred people who defend themselves with firearm actually end up hitting their target.

That said, I think being able to defend yourself with a weapon is still a good idea, in theory. What we need is better education.
Since one link was made to a silly, biased website, I'll try to balance it out with one that seems more reasonable.
http://www.justfacts.com/gun_control.htm
This seems to be pretty straightforward. Not all of the statistics are complete, but it is actually really hard to get complete stats on anything.

...Lastly, Felix, I apologize for helping to turn this thread into a "let's talk about the gun controversey" discussion if that's not what you intended. If somebody hadn't responded to RedLine's question, I wouldn't have been tempted to put in my two cents. It's all your fault, pyphor, all your fault! :D

[MNJetter]

Whoa, Feliz posted while I was writing. Now my post seems incongruous :p

[Felix_the_Cat]

hmm, for some reason I cannot edit my post?

*edited to add* I got my facts from "The Canadian Firearms Safety Course Student Handbook". This is the required reading for application for a license. The statistics are in Section 8-1

[Felix_the_Cat]

MNJetter:

This is where training comes into play. In my household (mind you right now it’s just me and the missus) we would go over what actions I would take in the event of a SHTF situation. I do not technically need to discharge my weapon to defend myself, I just like having the option. I train constantly with all of my firearms in both a sporting situation (I am a certified I.P.S.C shooter) and in a defensive capacity (I am also a certified I.D.P.A) shooter. I can guarantee you that out of the firearms owners I know, that more then 1 out of 100 can hit our targets :P.

But you do raise a good point, as I can only speak for certified and trained firearms owners. I think that training and certification should be mandatory (It sort of is here). Once again though, I am unfamiliar with the USA;s laws regarding firearms and firearm ownership and can only speak on what I know.

The next question I pose to those who do not agree with firearms would be; Have any of you been able to use firearms in a safe and appropriate situation/manner?

[stillbornsinger]

I will be carrying a 9mm baretta tonight at work.

I do not own a personal firearm at the moment but do plan to purchase a few when I move from Japan. I've been trained how to safely use a weapon and how to deal with a threat. Someday when I have children I will teach them proper weapon safety as well.

I'm really pissed that .50 cal's have been made illigal in California as I'd really like to own a .50 rifle. If only I had of moved there a few years ago...

[Buckwheat]

i own a .35 marlin lever action for deer hunting and a 12 guage double barrel for bird hunting.

it's been awhile since my last hunting trip though. college gets in the way a bit. My best kill was a very impressive 8 point buck.

[Kass]

Is there some reason we are bumping seriously old threads?

[Druid]

My most treasured possesion is a Black Dragoon that my great great great great grandpa owned. It's all engraved and awesome. I'd never sell it for any amount of money.

[Praetorian]

Is there some reason we are bumping seriously old threads?

This thread was made today, and there seems to be enough support for this thread. Although I'm not a gun nut, it's a nice change from the stupid discussions about wether evolution is true or false which will never, ever result in someone changing their views anyway.

[Ronette]

I used to go to a shooting range with my brother once in awhile when I was in Australia but I never wanted to go hunting or kill anything with them.

My father shot at someone who broke into our house once and I woke up rather rudely to a shotgun blast through the bedroom wall. After that I made him take the gun apart and not keep it beside his bed (he's a Vietnam vet and very weird) a few years later the house was broken into again and the guy stabbed my father in the neck with a very long screwdriver when he woke up after hearing the dog barking.

I was meant to arrive home at the time it happened but my friends car wouldn't start. My father survived the attack but I still feel bad for making him take apart that gun. Then again he would probably be in jail now if I hadn't have. I am undecided about whether I like guns in the house.

[Spaatz965]

Don't own a firearm, and likely won't. However, I did enjoy range days when I was a reservist. Missed qualifying expert by one target (and I swear the target *should* have gone down).

If I ever did get into shooting for fun, I'd probably stick with a .22 (just 'cause I'm a cheap SOB).

I think that training and certification should be mandatory (It sort of is here).
Am violently in agreement with you here. If someone is using/carrying a firearm, they should train to handle/use it safely and proficiently. There is zero excuse for an accidentle shooting related to the way a firearm is being handled. The story I always use to illustrate why safety rules always need to be followed comes from my tour in the 90-91 gulf war. I don't know this story to be true, but it sounds very plausible...

A pair of MP's at a cross road in an MP HUMVEE (this has the hard shell top with a turret hole cut out of the top and a mounted machine gun). One MP is in the driver's seat, the other in the turret. Turret MP decides to clean his pistol. Pulls the slide to verify the chamber is clear, releases the slide and drops the loaded clip. Then he pulls the trigger to uncock the weapon...blowing his buddy's head off... The guy in the turret had developed some lax/bad safety habits about how he handled firearms, and had gotten so used to handling unloaded weapons he got used to dropping the clip after checking the chamber, which of course, with a loaded weapon, chambers a round...but then again, this could have been the story going around to stress how important weapons safety is.

As to personal protection, on the off chance that I felt a firearm was needed in my home for protection, it'd be a 22 gauge shotgun loaded out with #4 birdshot for the first 2 shells, then with #3 buck shot. Figure with the size, it'll be easier to handle for both my wife and I...won't be worrying so much about kick. Also, with the shot, there's less chance of going through a wall and hurting someone unintentionally (like our kids). And a shotgun, even a 22 gauge is pretty intimidating to look down the barrel at.

Carrying for personal protection is out. I wouldn't have the discipline to train enough with the weapon...and would likely have it taken away and used on me by an assailant. But that's me and a personal evaluation/decision.

[DizBukHaPeter]

I went shootin for the first time a month ago. Theres a range near Dallas called Alpine shooting range. I got to shoot my uncles mossberg 500 pump 12 gauge. I shot bout 25 outta 60 clay (im only a beginner), and wasted 2 round in an hour. Funnest time i ever had, I love sort shooting now and i'm addicted. After that we headed outta to the 100 yard range for his rifle. Its a remington M700 in 30-06. Thing kicks like a mule, my groupings were alright but shooting was all the fun. The guy next to me had a Garand and his buddy had a lee enfield.

I'm only 16 but my dad is going to by a gun so i can shoot more. I want a Benelli nova for a shotgun and i'm looking for a rifle.

[Mechs]

I have to wait another year and a half till I fire any kinda of firearms (Army BCT) unless I get lucky. I want to get a CAR-15 and try to get my hands on a M-14 when I get older.

[karob]

I am picking up a .270 WSM bolt action from Remington or Winchester in Jan. That and a .45 1911-A1 from Springfield Armory. My parents got me a gun safe for xmas so it's time to fill it up. I shot a lot when I was younger but gave up on it when I entered HS. Now that I have moved out and have my own casa I am getting the itch to fire a weapon again. That and I want to go dear hunting in Northern California next season.

[Firebaall]

Fireball: That is one very nice looking savage. That Choate stock practically caught my eye :D. I have seen a few of those in my time and I love the feel of them, I am a fairly big guy, but it sill manages to make me look a little small:P. Good to see another Canadian owner abroad though :D Sadly with the way our government is moving, we are an endangered species.



Yea, I love it. I'm really big, so it fits me just right ( 6'4" @ 305 lbs ) :)

Here's a pic of me, then my younger brother. You'll see what I mean.

http://img79.exs.cx/img79/9973/DSC18.jpg

....it makes my brother look "dainty" lol

http://img79.exs.cx/img79/4950/DSC00024.jpg

[RDClip]

Being a curious Canadian, I would like to know how easy it is for a normal American to get a gun legally. As posted earlier in this thead, here it involves quite a complicated process to get a gun that includes classes, forms and whatnot.

As some may know gun murders are a hot topic now with the recent rash of murders in Toronto and the upcoming election. Seems that many Canadians are blaming the U.S for this problem. I was just wondering if there are like millions of guns that anyone with a bit of cash could buy without effort just floating around the States.

[Zslash]

Being a curious Canadian, I would like to know how easy it is for a normal American to get a gun legally. As posted earlier in this thead, here it involves quite a complicated process to get a gun that includes classes, forms and whatnot.

As some may know gun murders are a hot topic now with the recent rash of murders in Toronto and the upcoming election. Seems that many Canadians are blaming the U.S for this problem. I was just wondering if there are like millions of guns that anyone with a bit of cash could buy without effort just floating around the States.

I'll be the first to say it varies from state to state. Generally from what I've seen, closer you are to a major metropolitan city the harder it is to get a gun legally. Anyone more versed in this issue want to set me straight with some specifics? ;)

[Felix_the_Cat]

I'll be the first to say it varies from state to state. Generally from what I've seen, closer you are to a major metropolitan city the harder it is to get a gun legally. Anyone more versed in this issue want to set me straight with some specifics? ;)


I have seen in some states, such as Kalifornia, the laws are harsher then what we have in Canada. I know a bit of the CCW laws, but other then that, I have nothing to offer.

[jetsetter]

People must also remeber that shooting at ranges can be a sport much like archery. There is an Olympic shooting team.