JET Programs in Korea

[General_Admission]

After reading so much negative information about Japan I no longer think I could live there for more than a year. I know PLF has visited Korea and remember someone mentioning they lived there. How does Korea compare to Japan in how they treat foreigners. I know Korea is stereotyped as 'poor man's Japan,' that some of their cities can smell, and some people hate GI's (& thus all Americans?), but I may consider some type of JET program there instead of Japan. Also, I looked up Hangul on wikipedia (yeah, prob not best place) and it seems sooo much easier than Japanese. I think it's how all character based nations should form characters, but that's just me & a bunch of other people. In short, what's the + - on Korea from those who live/visit there first hand & are there any programs like JET?

[spaik]

korea is japan, but its not. korea isn't very foreigner friendly. well, that's not true, entirely. they'll treat you great as a guest, but you'll never fit in. poor man's japan actually fits really well. one thing is that koreans tend to be louder and more aggressive then japanese people. JET is something between the japanese govt and other govts. I don't think korea has an equivalent.

[PopCulturePooka]

Plus in recent months theres been this huge public backlash against male foreigners there. Its getting nasty.

[General_Admission]

korea is japan, but its not. korea isn't very foreigner friendly. well, that's not true, entirely. they'll treat you great as a guest, but you'll never fit in. poor man's japan actually fits really well. one thing is that koreans tend to be louder and more aggressive then japanese people. JET is something between the japanese govt and other govts. I don't think korea has an equivalent.

Well that too, that's a huge + to me. I've noticed that Korean girls at my school love to hit/push people. I just think I might be more sane around people that aren't entirely like drones. :confused:

[spaik]

it doesn't just mean girls, dude. seriously, as a foreigner, you'll get into a fistfight with a korean guy at a bar, just for looking at him the wrong way... or if he thinks that you did. think about what it'd be like to be a black man in an irish bar, and you got a good idea what's gonna happen. i don't care if you are huge, korean guys are crazy when drunk, and will fight anyone, even knowing they'll get pounded. that's not the kind of shit that would keep me sane, man.

[General_Admission]

it doesn't just mean girls, dude. seriously, as a foreigner, you'll get into a fistfight with a korean guy at a bar, just for looking at him the wrong way... or if he thinks that you did. think about what it'd be like to be a black man in an irish bar, and you got a good idea what's gonna happen. i don't care if you are huge, korean guys are crazy when drunk, and will fight anyone, even knowing they'll get pounded. that's not the kind of shit that would keep me sane, man.

What kind of bars do you go to? I mean, it can't be like that eveywhere?

[PopCulturePooka]

From the articles I read recently it IS everywhere. Korean men are getting jealous or something.

[spaik]

i guess no one read it before it got bombed from the forum reset, but korean guys are like that. we fight. we fight over anything. give us a half reason to throw down, and we will. at least when we are drunk. we also drink. a LOT. so guess what? anytime you go to a place where you drink, you'll find korean guys just lookin for a fight. and if u got a korean vs a non-korean? guess what, koreans are the most paranoid xenophobic fuckers out there. i mean, damn, koreans hate everyone. not thinking they are superior, like what it seems japanese people think, but that everyone else is hella shady and out to get them. you can bet your ass that even if u didn't pick that fight, if u throw down, some random korean guy will back up the korean just cause you're white. don't underestimate just how much hate korea has for everyone else.

[scan2001]

I have a lot of friends that teach in Korea. I have a friend who is going to marry a Korean girl this November and another friend who met a Japanese girl in Korea. They are also getting marry. I'm kind of seeing a theme here. The point is that most Koreans are cool with foreigners. Unless you are Japanese.

[akitaka]

So that's a huge minus for someone like myself (second-gen Japanese, born in the U.S.). Spaik, I'm not sure where you live and all, but have you stayed in Korea long enough to know the conclusion?

[Sayaka]

Plus in recent months theres been this huge public backlash against male foreigners there. Its getting nasty.

:confused: So Korean women aren't as crazy over gaijin as Japanese women are?

I have a friend who is going to marry a Korean girl this November and another friend who met a Japanese girl in Korea. They are also getting marry.
These are white guys, right :rolleyes: ?

[scan2001]

Yes they are white guys.

[Sayaka]

How hot are the women they're about to marry? pro-yellow fever campaign material?

[General_Admission]

^ wow...o_O

As hot as any other girls. Are you implying that you want to go to Korea for a 'sex trip?'

[StormShadow]

Dude, My GF is korean, and has a lot of Korean friends, and in my opinion the Koreans are the best looking bunch in Asia. There are of course non-koreans that are mighty sexy, but in the majority I'd say Korea has got the best women. They're crazy though.

[yahoodood]

general_admissions, good luck with learning korean. seriously.

although the korean alphabet being much easier to learn the prounciation for many things are quite difficult to learn for many "foreigners". people ranging from Americans to even the japnaese have problems learning how to pronounce the language. The accents are also hard to understand being that most of the words that are said are changed into something that is hard to recongize, although that is true for most langugages and their accents.

To try to avoid that, try living near Seoul and learning the "proper" way to speak.

Although chinese isn't necessary for written use ( like kanji) you may encounter "hanja" which is the korean usage of chinese, although it is very unfrequent and is mostly used for dictionary use and you shouldn't need to worry about it.

Korean food seems to appeal quite the variety of people, so you should be fine. korean restaurants tend to give you A LOT but try to avoid having beef in your meal if you are on a budget. Kal-bi seems to be an extremely popular food to eat, its even to the point where there's kalbi restaurants in japan in america! Kal-bi is a seasoned strips of thin beef that has a somewhat sweet flavor although i seem to be the only one in the world who isn't vegetarian who dislikes it. :confused:

If you NEED internet access there's soooooo many PC 방's (what they call internet cafe's) and you'll probably find one on every block.

cell phones tend to be quite expensive and very high tech but the plans for them (For access and such) are supposedly very affordable.

Being that you want to teach in korea, if you are (un?)fortunate enough to teach a younger students you may face kancho/kancho attempt(s). In korea kancho's are called Ddong-chim (its really hard to romanize korean... >.<) and is identical to how japanese youngsters play this "game". Although some ddong-chims have been filed as a "crime" and some people being punished for doing so, you'll probably won't have to face anything bad with it(legal wise).

meh... i can't think of much else to tell you at the moment...but i hope you found my information useful... ^.^;;

[spaik]

conclusion to what? to koreans being hella xenophobic paranoid fuckers and thinking everyone else is shady? or conclusion to koreans picking fights when drunk, whether you're a foreigner or korean? if it's either of those two, then there isn't one.

Dude, My GF is korean, and has a lot of Korean friends, and in my opinion the Koreans are the best looking bunch in Asia. There are of course non-koreans that are mighty sexy, but in the majority I'd say Korea has got the best women. They're crazy though.

THIS IS THE TRUTH.

[General_Admission]

@ yahoodood: Yes, thank you. It is very useful to me. ^^

& yes I love Korean food! It is soul food! A few more questions though.

What about the general economy; ie. how do most people stand financially, quality of infrastructure? What is the quality of cleanliness? What is the general quality of life and the living conditions? What cities would you compare it to in the US safety wise?

[akitaka]

Hmm. I found this (http://www.koilaf.org/what_view.php?num=352) link to be helpful. Working hours don't seem harsh...but it really depends on the business, where the bigger ones have less (according to their survey).

The site also has some news about labor in Korea...if that interests you.

[yahoodood]

@ yahoodood: Yes, thank you. It is very useful to me. ^^

& yes I love Korean food! It is soul food! A few more questions though.

What about the general economy; ie. how do most people stand financially, quality of infrastructure? What is the quality of cleanliness? What is the general quality of life and the living conditions? What cities would you compare it to in the US safety wise?

well, i really don't konw too much about how the cities would treat foreginers and how it would be. Since my last visit to korea, i was ridiculed by my cousin's kids for my inability to speak korean fluently and kept calling me "me-gook-in" or american. I protested saying that i was a native korean but they were pretty stubborn about the topic so i just gave up and just got them back in other ways : ;). Seoul seemed nice and there was a US army base, (which i happened to be born in) that i saw which seemed like there wasn't a tension between the army and the koreans.
You'll have to research a little bit seeing how I have not too much knowledge about the saftey of most cities.

The korean economy is a good one, but i hear the minimum wage is quite quite low, although you shouldn't have to worry about it because you're aspiring to be an english teacher. English teachers always get paid decently.
You'd probably get a nice wage of 40k+ or a lower one with an aparment paid for you(which is a LIFE saver... apartments, like in japan are crazy expenisve...seriously...) you'll have to look around for these deals but i'm sure you could find one.

[Sayaka]

As hot as any other girls.

Weak.

Are you implying that you want to go to Korea for a 'sex trip?'
If you can't tell by my username, I'M A GIRL DUMBASS. So I wouldn't be as turned on by Asian cunt as some other people. I was just trying to see if they were proving an Asian stereotype true or not.

[Mr.Babalo]

Dude, My GF is korean, and has a lot of Korean friends, and in my opinion the Koreans are the best looking bunch in Asia. There are of course non-koreans that are mighty sexy, but in the majority I'd say Korea has got the best women. They're crazy though.

i agree with you on that one just from general experience, except i'd say viets are on the same level as well. However the majority of viet girls tend to be more "stacked", from what i've gathered.

[StormShadow]

Really? I've only met a couple of Viet gals, and they reminded me of little girls based upon their size. Even if they were in their 20's I could never date them merely because I'd feel like a pervert dating a child

[Henjin]

Well, going off the Korean movie I just watched last night, it's fulla nothing but gangsters who beat the crap out of each other... And the women do the same thing, but on a somewhat smaller scale. lol


In all honesty, I know movies don't tell you anything accurate about the places they're set it, but Korea looks a lot scarier than Japan to me.

[bulgasari]

I've worked in Korea as an English teacher for over 4 years. I certainly had a chuckle at the 'Koreans will pick a fight anywhere, anytime' bit above. I've never been in a fight here (though I never got in fights back home either), and I can think of only one or two friends off hand who have gotten into fights with Koreans - expats are much more likely to get into fights with other expats than Koreans. Korean cities are very safe - much safer than those back home (though of course, some areas are rougher than others). I mean, little kids walk around unsupervised late at night without a care in the world. Generally, to get into trouble, either you'd have to run into a really drunken asshole, or... be a really drunken asshole yourself. And yes, there are certainly xenophobic tendencies amongst people here, which contributes to and is the result of nationalism (which bounces between 'we are the best' and 'we are such aggrieved victims'), but you generally find this on the internet (netizen culture there is pretty...unique, as its both ultra hi-tech and hermetically sealed, in some ways, from the rest of the world).

(btw - that hatred of English teachers? It existed in the media and on the internet, but other than the government deciding to crack down on foreigners teaching illegally (without the proper visa), nothing came of it offline, that i ever heard. I wouldn't put much faith in the Korean media - Sensationalism is a great way to sell papers, and race baiting isn't uncommon. There's often a difference between the Korean content of these papers and the content of the online English editions as well, though things have been improving.)

The younger generations, which have grown up after the military dictatorships and the days of poverty, and who are two generations removed from the war, tend to look forward to reunification (as, uh, they're told nothing bad about the North anymore) and to blame the US military presence for the nation's division in 1945 (which is mostly true) and for their support of dictators and authoritarian rulers over the years. The battle between left and right in Korea was won by the right in the 40s and 50s and they kept the left beaten down for decades - but now that democracy has come and those decades are being reconsidered, it's basically 'payback time'. I think it's something that has to play itself out and will take time - but there is a great deal of ill feeling towards the US army and the US in general (the Bush administration has made this feeling much worse), but at the same time many people want their kids educated there, or to move there, so it's a double-edged, often contradictory thing. And we won't bring up Japan. Japan is just baaaaaaaad here. End of story, not worth debating. They're taught this in school, and politicians can use this undercurrent of anti-japanese sentiment to get support when their polls are low (like Roh did back in April).

On the subject of Korea and Japan, I think Koreans are much more open and friendly than Japanese, at least according to people who have lived in both places. The general consensus among these people is that Koreans are friendly and more open and laid back in conversation, but not as laid back/cool popular culture-wise as Japan is. There is some indie culture/cool bands/cool clubs here, but you have to dig a little more to find them than in Japan. Japanese people on the other hand are more formal in their, say body language and communicating (like, you could go ages in Korea without knowing how to say excuse me, whereas in Japan it's one of the first phrases you need to know) - Koreans don't care as much. I remember a journalist saying the exact opposite of what someone said above - he had a Japanese wife, but never felt he could fit in in Japan, but relished his assignments in Korea, which he thought was more open and friendly.

Also, Korean takes little effort to be able to read it (very handy for restaurants and buses). It's not too hard to pick up some 'survival' Korean, which should do you fine, as so many people speak some English. I really should know more Korean than I do - but what I've learned is generally adequate for classrooms (being able to translate a lot of the basic vocabulary, ask kids questions about their weekends, assign homework), but not so much for hanging out with people my age!

Provincial cities are not as foreigner friendly as Seoul (in the sense that you can buy, say, almost any kind of food you want in Seoul and perhaps not as many people speak English). The only truly expensive thing in Korea is Housing, which is almost always paid for in any Teaching contract. To travel around the country, stay in motels, or eat Korean food is very reasonable. The public transit system is very efficient and cheap. The cities here are being redeveloped at an insane rate - you'll have older run-down areas next to spanking new apartment blocks (which is what everyone wants to live in). And the new apartments look the same. Everywhere. It's very different compared to Japan in that regard, where any city (except the really big'uns) is usually a downtown of office buildings and some apartment blocks which is surrounded by areas made up of single family houses. Korean cities are not very pleasing to the eye in that regard, but the newer areas are generally pretty clean (except for around drinking districts, where you can expect to see sidewalk pancakes regularly).

If you plan to come teach here investigate carefully; there are a lot of idiot hakwon (private institutes) owners out there. Stuff like housing, vacation, sick days, overtime, schedule and breaks, curriculum (is there one?) amount of extra 'special classes' to be added during public school vacations - these should be looked into very carefully. There are a lot of shady recruiters out there too. There are blacklist pages which you can check to see if a prospective school is on it. daves esl cafe, english spectrum - there are several sites with a lot of guides that can help you.

[atomiton]

interesting. i think, honestly, japan is put in a bad light, just like Korean was. Also if it's any consolation, Korean is the easiest of the major asian languages (save tagalog, which is very much like tagalog)... more sounds than japanese, but less homonyms, and SO EASY to read. no tones like Chinese, and very little use of characters... no strange gutturol or sipthongs like vietnamese... and it looks cool.

never mention that Korean Sushi came from Japan... ^_^

[StormShadow]

Korean is quite easy to read. My only problems are understanding what I'm reading. King Sejong even said that a foolish person could read Korean after 10 days, but that doesn't mean he'll understand it.

[atomiton]

it's the same grammatical structure as japanese. difficult, but not impossible.
i'd rather deal with how to pronounce Korean than how to speak or write chinese... but that's not impossible, either, mind you. in fact, Japanese without Kanji is annoying.

[StormShadow]

Oh, don't get me wrong. I can pronounce it, and I can read it, I just don't know what it mean. Like looking at the word dog. You can read it. You know it says dog. But you don't know what a dog is. Does that make sense? Each day I get a little better, but sometimes I hit that snag, and I go, wtf is this? But I can read, write, and speak it. Just don't know what it says.

[bulgasari]

I think you mean you can sound it out, right? You can 'read' what it says (as in know what sounds the characters make) but not have any idea what it means. You could read '하나라당 즐' and know that it reads 'hanaradang jeul', but not have a clue what that means.

Menus are good for practicing as many restaurants will have at least a few items whose korean names are derived from english. (French fries, cola, etc). Of course, the way they 'hangeul-ize' some words can make then nearly unintelligable as english words - like 후렌치후라이스 (hu-ren-chi hu-ra-i-seu) - what with the lack of f,v,b, and th as well as it's syllabic structure. I find I can read an speak some Korean, but it's listening that always gets me as people speak so fast (that's true in any culture, of course); well, actually, kids speak fast and I understand a lot of what they say, it's more the typical 'where are you from/how long have you been here/ are you married' questions that throw me (as I never hear them from my students).

[StormShadow]

Dude,
Gold star goes to you, you understood what I meant. Some words that I don't know I can understand by reading. I went to this little Asian market the other day, and got stuff market 'Ramen', only it said that in Korean. I felt very proud. Yeah, listening sucks. The tapes I have just go super fast, like the Flash is speaking Korean. Good greif

[yahoodood]

I think you mean you can sound it out, right? You can 'read' what it says (as in know what sounds the characters make) but not have any idea what it means. You could read '하나라당 즐' and know that it reads 'hanaradang jeul', but not have a clue what that means.

Menus are good for practicing as many restaurants will have at least a few items whose korean names are derived from english. (French fries, cola, etc). Of course, the way they 'hangeul-ize' some words can make then nearly unintelligable as english words - like 후렌치후라이스 (hu-ren-chi hu-ra-i-seu) - what with the lack of f,v,b, and th as well as it's syllabic structure. I find I can read an speak some Korean, but it's listening that always gets me as people speak so fast (that's true in any culture, of course); well, actually, kids speak fast and I understand a lot of what they say, it's more the typical 'where are you from/how long have you been here/ are you married' questions that throw me (as I never hear them from my students).



hm... i thought for "french fries" they would use 푸랜지프라이스(pu-ren-chi- pu-rai-su)　but I guess its the prefernce of the people who write the menu. but meh. No need to argue that.

PC방's are so cheap... xD I wanna go back and go into one of those comfy comfy.. though it reminds me that this one old lady saw that i was an americanized korean and was trying to sell me 김밥　like no tommorow, even though i told her i wasn't hungry, i "hate" it ( which i dont... but she didn' t get the message) then that i just ignored her. It seems mean, but she was so annoying and trying to make me buy one.

The plus side about that particular PC방 was that it was one of the cheaper ones in the area ( literrally a buck an hour) with crazy comfy seats and every MMO/pc game that you would ever want to play. Starcraft and Warcraft, Diablo II, ragnarok online (this was 3 years ago though... but whatever) and some other MMO's that i didn't recognize at the time but can't remember the names of it now. i also think there were some FPS's but i'm probably wrong, seeing how it wasn't until recently that south korea allowed such games to be in the country.

on reading... it irks me like hell when some words you'd THINK you would spell phonetically come out... all werid. like 도에지(do ae ji) ｗhen it sounds more like 대지 (Dae-ji) when people are speaking (dae-ji means pig for those that are unknowning). Gah!

I still need to become more fluent in Korean... T.T

[StormShadow]

Here is a question. According to Berlitz, meat is ga-gee. So if you take Ke-go-gee and saw-go-gee and take out the part that says 'Meat', would the word ke be dog and saw ne cow? My books don't say animals, and my computer is being repaired, so I can't use my computer program!

[dillon]

yeah, ke (pronounced more like "gheh") means dog and saw (pronounced more like "shoh") means cow but that doesn't work for everything.

[StormShadow]

excellent. I've been trying to teach my dog to speak Korean, so when I thow his tennis ball I yell "Kajoosayo", and when he bring it back I say "tasee awda". Be he really isn't learning anything, so I have decided to rename him Kegogi

[yahoodood]

heh... cute...
it'd be kind of interesting if a korean person happened to ask the name of your dog :D

but alas... I was thinking (if i ever got a dog or a cow... ^_^;;) to name the cow Kom-tang or Kalbi-tang... hehe (in fact... thats what i did in the harvest moon games... naming all the cows beef product names in korean... and the dog just... Gogi... xD)

But in real life, i'd probably call my dog ke jang kook. :D

[StormShadow]

I saw this thing on German Shepards that were trained to speak German and English. They sell them for high-secrurity jobs. My dog barely understand English half the time, so I am thinking about putting on the brakes to my langauge lessons. But I do plan n naming the next dog I get Kegogi, or any other animal the animal meat name. It just seems classy. My dog is still named 'Optimus Prime', but he gets the nickname Kegogi. You been to Korea? I so want to go. My dad didn't like it, when he was there in the Army, but I think that's because your not there to enjoy it.

[yahoodood]

i've been there once since birth.

Basically i went like 3ish years ago. I miss it, although i didn't get to do TOO much because of lack of knowledge of the langugage and transportation.(mum didn't think it was safe for me to go on the subway/bus/taxi... for good reason.. i was 13...)

I went to Lotte world, which was the most english speaking foreigner friendly theme park ever. *grumbles about annoying songs sung in english that were extremely loud and annoying* IF you ever swing by there... look for a thing called "magic donkey" and put 200 won or so in it... you'll get a suprise... and probably laugh your ass off. I'm SO sad that i didn't get a pic of that.

On another note, there's quite a few Hotels that provide service americans and stuff, but be prepared to understand korean people with bad (korean) english accents or the occasional british accent, which is amusing when you hear a native korean speak with an english accent... it just seems... WERID.

[StormShadow]

I've been learning the language because my GF is adopted Korean. We would like to go someday, but she has little grasp of the langauge and a lack of desire to learn anything about Korea. I like it though. I like the writing system. I hope to speak it fluently enough to make it to the places tourists normally don't go, as those places are usually the most fulfilling places to see or do things.

Magic donkey? What is this?

[yahoodood]

the magiac donkey is ironically, a chocolate dispenser. it takes a form of a donkey and is mechinezed so it moves its head and tail an makes a HEEHAW sound.

i don't THINK this is a mainstream thing... only something i saw in lotte world.

Hilariously enough, after depsoting money in the "magic donkey" it sounds constipated with its Hee haw and out shoots a container filled with chocolate out of its ass... sometimes its shoots faster and harder then others... Thus the "magic donkey". But all the time...especially the first expierence is funny when you are like WTFOMGLOLBBQ. i SO regret not bringing my camera. T_T