Homicide

[MNJetter]

Is it ever justifiable? Does the definition of justifiable change when certain types of people do it (i.e., police, etc.)?

We've had a few threads in the past about homicides that brought up some good conversation -- the guy in Texas who shot some tresspassers in the back in defense of someone else's property, or the police officers in California who shot a guy....also in the back, ironically.

In the past, in many countries, the definition of what is justifiable or not was very different from how we view it today. Duels, for instance, were once a perfectly acceptable way to address a grievance between two willing participants. And there are some groups - Quakers, for instance - who say that homicide is not justifiable in any situation, and they refuse to take part in any form of it, including being drafted into the military. Not just religious people, either. After WWII, Einstein himself became a staunch pacifist.

[Kannon]

I'm a very... vindictive individual. An eye for an eye, and what not. Being brought up Catholic (not currently practicing, more of a Christian that keeps his spirituality to himself...) I would have issue with how I felt, but the more and more I see the acts of violence humans are able to perform, the more and more I want to bring these people to justice. I've grown very empathetic, and when I see the destruction on innocent peoples' lives that psychotic people create, the more I feel I could kill. The fact that I have to be ok with the possibility that I would have to take someone's life in the line of duty I think makes it easier. But when I hear of rapes, kidnaps, torture, be it mental or physical, the more I think of the victim, the more I think of bringing justice to those that commit these crimes.

So yes, in my opinion, situation depending, I think homicide is justifiable.

[farstrider]

My personal belief is that homicide is justifiable in defense of the lives of others. If it comes down to a choice between "him or me", I'd much rather it be him. Also, I bet you'd be hard pressed to find a parent who wouldn't agree that protecting one's children is a perfectly justifiable reason for homicide.

[Jetsetlemming]

Homicide has specific tones to it, implying unjustifiable murder. Killing as a wider concept has a more neutral idea, and I think there are certainly justifiable kills. Killing an attacker in self defense, police shooting an armed suspect threatening victims, wartime casualties, etc. Probably the most extreme standing in the "justifiable kill" banner would be the deaths caused by Fat Man and Little Boy, due to the lives they saved and the forewarning to the bombings.

[MNJetter]

Actually, the reason why I picked homicide was because it was more all-encompassing than murder. Legally, you can have justifiable homocide, negligent homicide, etc.. If it moves into the murder sphere, they actually call it murder. And killing can refer to any creature, not just humans. So I did purposefully choose the word, for a specific definition that really has no other direct synonyms.

Personally, I don't think modern society has a good feel for when homicide is justifiable. I would be more likely to forgive a duel, for instance, than soldiers killing civilians in a war that was started for a personal or greed-driven reason.

[Fred]

I think Jetset makes a good point with regards to terminology. I think this is the kind of discussion where the definition of terminology matters.

When I read the original question, “Is [homicide] ever justifiable?” I thought most people find a way to justify their behavior. So, I thought of some more specific questions.

1. Is there ever a situation where I would be supportive of a “private citizen” intentionally, and with premeditation, ending someone’s life without that person facing any legal or civil consequences? I can think of at least one situation, which is assisted suicide for a terminally ill relative.

2. Is there ever a situation where I would be sympathetic towards a “private citizen” intentionally, and with premeditation, ending someone’s life provided they faced legal and civil consequences? It is easier for me to think of cases where I would feel sympathetic, but still feel they should face the legal consequences of their action. For example, someone who had been abused for years might plot to kill their abuser.

3. Is there ever a situation where I would be supportive of a “private citizen” intentionally, but without premeditation, ending someone’s life without that person facing any legal or civil consequences? Yes – self defense against mortal force provided the individual made every effort to avoid the confrontation.

4. Does the State have the right to execute citizens? – Yes, provided they are able to do so without bias.

[Mittens]

If people kill others for personal gain, vengeance, or anything that pertains to the killer's personality in that strata, then I personally think it is wrong.

Obviously, there can be an infinite amount of situations where homicide can be questionable (just make an elobrate plot in your head about killing someone innocent to save your family or yourself.)

Self-defence is understandable, I would kill to save my life, or to save the life of another. Same with a hostage situation, and so on and so on.

The only gray area for me is killing for a greater good.
That's the only concept that really makes me scratch my head.

Then again, I'm not pretending like I know much about this area, but I do have my own personal guidelines.

[Swede]

Killing should most definitely avoided, and it should be the last thing someone decides to do when it comes to dealing with a particular problem. That being said, it can be justified I think, namely in cases where if someone or a group of people aren't killed it will result in others being killed. Basically like tolerance- the only thing I won't tolerate is intolerance and all that.