Water safety in Osaka

[amg]

My coworkers told me that the water isn't 100% safe to drink during the rainy and summer seasons, and they tell me that they boil tap water before they serve it to the kids we work with. My girlfriend just suggested to me that we use bottled water when we're making soup. She related a story of when she asked a guy at the suidoukyoku about it, and he told her that though he doesn't often say it the water here is chlorinated to the point where it's unhealthy to be drinking it all the time. She asked him if boiling it would make it okay, and he said that boiling it increases the damage it can inflict twofold.

I can believe that when its very rainy or very dry that some nasty things might get in the water supply. I can believe that water is chlorinated more than is necessary for sanitation. To suggest that boiling is not enough, though, seems paranoid, or prissy, to a ridiculous extreme. Anybody have any experience, knowledge, or thoughts? I'm kind of anti-bottled water inclined when I'm in the states, I know enough about phthalates that I don't want to drink more out of a pet bottle than I have to, and I know that boiling water pushes the highly volatile chlorine out of it very very quickly.

[erbiumfiber]

I use a filter on my tap in the kitchen- I filter for drinking and cooking and don't filter for washing. The water tastes great! There are an infinite number of filters for sale in an home center in the Tokyo area (and I'm guessing the rest of Japan as well). They install very easily and are cheap to use (a 3000 yen cartridge lasts forever). There is counter that counts up to 1500 liters (for my model) then it's time to change it.

I've installed them in rental apartments as well and it's easy to restore the original hardware. Could do it in a guesthouse as well I'm sure.

[gentlemanandscholar]

I just stick with my 89 Yen 2 litre bottles. It's already cold! Sweet.

[Hikoku-Y]

I drink straight from the tap. Not dead yet.

Though after reading this, I may switch to bottled.

[Steve]

I use a filter on my tap in the kitchen- I filter for drinking and cooking and don't filter for washing. The water tastes great! There are an infinite number of filters for sale in an home center in the Tokyo area (and I'm guessing the rest of Japan as well). They install very easily and are cheap to use (a 3000 yen cartridge lasts forever). There is counter that counts up to 1500 liters (for my model) then it's time to change it.

I've installed them in rental apartments as well and it's easy to restore the original hardware. Could do it in a guesthouse as well I'm sure.

Is Japanese water fluoridated? If so, make sure your filter doesn't filter it our. :)

I just stick with my 89 Yen 2 litre bottles. It's already cold! Sweet.

Your missing out on the fluoride. :(

[gentlemanandscholar]

So that's why my teeth have been falling out!

[Steve]

So that's why my teeth have been falling out!

Do I sense sarcasm? :gloomy:

But anyway, despite your remark, you've pretty much hit the nail on the head. Fluoridated water will aid you in keeping your teeth healthy. :)

[koku]

I just stick with my 89 Yen 2 litre bottles. It's already cold! Sweet.

There ya go. Problem solved and end of thread.

[Clear.tranquil]

Is that why there so many crooked teeth?

[mawande]

Clear.tranquil... is that a serious question? It's not always hard to tell.

The reason there are so many crooked teeth is the same as it was traditionally in England. Because no one spends the money on the dental work to change it. It's massively expensive in Japan.

[six-eight-ten]

While boiling may kill off some bacteria, parameceum, or other things in te water (but not all), it will do nothing to many other forms of contamination, such as chemical pollution (depending on the chemicals, of course- I suppose some of them would turn to a gas befoe the water would).

[erbiumfiber]

Japanese water does not have fluoride, as far as I know. I was watching a show where they were showing how Australians could eat all sorts of junk food and their teeth were fine. It's the show where they do a little skit and then ask...NAZE????

The answer was FLUORIDE!!

I do believe some of the U.S. bases put it in the water.

Up until about 7th grade we had well water with no fluoride...and, yeah, I did get cavities. I admit I haven't been to the dentist in a bit, but (knock on wood) I haven't had any pain since I've been here.

[Gorlam]

I just stick with my 89 Yen 2 litre bottles. It's already cold! Sweet.

water filters are pretty cheap to buy and you end up saving money in the long run. Also if you are into water conservation, buying a filter wastes less water.



Japanese water does not have fluoride, as far as I know. I was watching a show where they were showing how Australians could eat all sorts of junk food and their teeth were fine. It's the show where they do a little skit and then ask...NAZE????

The answer was FLUORIDE!!

I do believe some of the U.S. bases put it in the water.

Up until about 7th grade we had well water with no fluoride...and, yeah, I did get cavities. I admit I haven't been to the dentist in a bit, but (knock on wood) I haven't had any pain since I've been here.

Yah it can be weird, we drink well water at my house, I have never had a single cavity but I think my brother has had at least 3.

[Matt W]

I drink the water here in Osaka straight from the tap, though I have heard its not the best water in Japan.

This short video pretty much sums up my opinion on bottled water:
http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=oVusJLaiWdo

[mikem]

Your missing out on the fluoride. :(

No water supply system in Japan adds fluoride. It's completely obvious too. Most toothpaste and mouth rinse has it however.

OP:
The tap water in Japan is always safe to drink, but will tend to have a strong taste after the rain. This is just another Japanese wives tale left over from the dark ages.

(I do agree that properly filtered water makes tea taste better though.)

[Steve]

Japanese water does not have fluoride, as far as I know. I was watching a show where they were showing how Australians could eat all sorts of junk food and their teeth were fine. It's the show where they do a little skit and then ask...NAZE????

The answer was FLUORIDE!!

I do believe some of the U.S. bases put it in the water.

Up until about 7th grade we had well water with no fluoride...and, yeah, I did get cavities. I admit I haven't been to the dentist in a bit, but (knock on wood) I haven't had any pain since I've been here.

Really? Damn, how can such an advanced country not have fluoridated water supplies. Gee...*slaps forehead*

Oh and to be honest, if your teeth are fine, there's no need to see a dentist. Some dentists haven't had their teeth checked for about 10 years. Although if you get quite a bit of calculus (tartar) build up, you'd probably want to get that professionally removed.


Yah it can be weird, we drink well water at my house, I have never had a single cavity but I think my brother has had at least 3.

The thing is, cavities (caries) is a multifactorial disease. Some people might go throughout their whole lives, eating sugary crap and never brush their teeth properly and might have better teeth than you just because they don't have the right type of bacteria which causes cavities. That's just one reason though, there could be many others. Fluoride is known as the magic bullet in preventing cavities but it there are other factors as well.

No water supply system in Japan adds fluoride. It's completely obvious too. Most toothpaste and mouth rinse has it however.

OP:
The tap water in Japan is always safe to drink, but will tend to have a strong taste after the rain. This is just another Japanese wives tale left over from the dark ages.

(I do agree that properly filtered water makes tea taste better though.)

Like I said before, damn. *shakes head*

Oh and most people rinse their mouth after brushing their teeth, right? Coz that's what I did before I entered dental school and learned that I've been doing it wrong for my entire life. If you rinse straight after brushing then you're effectively removing the fluoride.

Also fluoridated water is great in that you get a low dose over a long period which has been shown to be more effective.

[erbiumfiber]

I know you can buy fluoridated bottled water in the U.S. and maybe through Foreign Buyer's Club in Japan.

Since you're up on all things dental, is there an ingestible source of fluoride to replace the fluoride I'm not getting through the water? And are those fluoride rinses any good?

And thanks for the advice about rinsing after brushing your teeth- that I did not know but makes a lot of sense.

And I use a sonic toothbrush and recently had braces (taken off in 2002) and my orthodontist was highly complimentary of my oral hygiene (thanks to the sonic toothbrush and all the advances in anti-tartar toothpaste- I always use American anti-tartar toothpaste which I believe to be superior to Japanese toothpaste).

[Steve]

OMG, I made a massive reply and then them it disappeared. :(

Anyways, I'll try my best to answer your questions point by point.

I know you can buy fluoridated bottled water in the U.S. and maybe through Foreign Buyer's Club in Japan.

That's certainly a good idea if you can afford it.

Since you're up on all things dental, is there an ingestible source of fluoride to replace the fluoride I'm not getting through the water?

Traditionally, fluoride tablets and drops were used especially for children but we have been taught that this is no longer recommended in Australia. For patients deemed at risk, the last resort would be to recommend dissolving fluoride drops into non-fluoridated water and making the concentration of fluoride up to about 0.9-1ppm.

I remember from past posts that you have children? If they are young, it may not be a good idea as there is a risk of fluorosis if they ingest too much either by making too high a concentration or if they somehow ingested the drops straight. How old are your children?

It's good that you use fluoridated toothpaste because during routine brushing, you'll probably swallow some of it anyway.

I dunno if it's available in Japan but I heard they started fluoridating rice in some Asian countries.

And are those fluoride rinses any good?

They are definitely beneficial but not absolutely necessary unless you are at risk (i.e. braces, high caries [decay] rate, low saliva flow etc). But if you can afford it then why not, I'd say. Just avoid the ones with alcohol though as they dry the mouth.

It must be noted that they are not recommended for children under 10 though.

And thanks for the advice about rinsing after brushing your teeth- that I did not know but makes a lot of sense.

Just to make sure, it's okay to spit out the foam and stuff, just don't rinse your mouth out afterwards. Some people feel really uncomfortable with this so an alternative would be to smear some toothpaste on your teeth after a rinse.

And I use a sonic toothbrush and recently had braces (taken off in 2002) and my orthodontist was highly complimentary of my oral hygiene (thanks to the sonic toothbrush and all the advances in anti-tartar toothpaste- I always use American anti-tartar toothpaste which I believe to be superior to Japanese toothpaste).

I haven't used it personally but I've heard good things about the sonic toothbrush. It's quite expensive but I guess if it's good then it's worth it but for anyone with financial difficulty, a normal manual toothbrush will be adequate.

I apologise for the huge spiel I've posted but I just love all things teeth. Feel free to ask me to clarify any points I've made or ask any other dental related questions and I'll try my best to answer them. There will be some stuff I can't answer though coz I'm just a dental student, not a full fledged dentist yet. :)

[amg]

Yay oral hygeine! Cavity-free my whole life and only slightly obsessive about brush'n'floss after meals.


OP:
The tap water in Japan is always safe to drink, but will tend to have a strong taste after the rain. This is just another Japanese wives tale left over from the dark ages.

I kiiiind of suspect that this is the case and that the guy at the Water Authority that she spoke with was just passing it on as he knew it. But somewhere between her asking of the guy and her telling me the reason behind the twofold increase in unhealthiness got lost. It kind of smacks of bullshit, like someone trying to justify their bottled water habit with contradiction and magnification. "You know if you boil it the water it'll be safe to drink." "Nuh-uh, if you boil the water it'll be TWICE AS BAD! Boo ya!" Safe drinking water is pretty much connoted with a first-world country, but it wouldn't be the first problem I've heard of if it wasn't utterly safe here.

[japanat]

My first year in Japan, a lot of people got sick in Himeji at the beginning of rainy season. Apparently, they didn't increase the chlorination soon enough, and had a bacteria bloom.

Re: flouride. My dentist told me that real macha provides a small amount of flouride. But black tea doesn't, which I don't understand - can flouride be destroyed or combined when the leaves are heated/cured? They also told me to use only small amounts of toothpaste, about the size of 2-3 grains of rice. They said too much toothpaste was causing my gums to recede in front...

[gentlemanandscholar]

water filters are pretty cheap to buy and you end up saving money in the long run. Also if you are into water conservation, buying a filter wastes less water.

My water bill each month is 1500 yen. I don't know how I could conserve any more without dying :bwitch:

I drink the water here in Osaka straight from the tap, though I have heard its not the best water in Japan.

This short video pretty much sums up my opinion on bottled water:
http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=oVusJLaiWdo
http://www.plasticsinfo.org/s_plasticsinfo/sec_level2_faq.asp?CID=705&DID=2839

That info about carcinogens and bacteria is just an email hoax.
But the money thing, yeah. That's still valid.

[amg]

http://www.plasticsinfo.org/s_plasticsinfo/sec_level2_faq.asp?CID=705&DID=2839

That info about carcinogens and bacteria is just an email hoax.
But the money thing, yeah. That's still valid.

Straying ever further off topic, but information put forth by the plastics division of the American Chemistry Council might be a bit biased. The guys campaigning against it are too, to be sure, but I'd be careful not to read something on a more official-looking website denouncing a viral video and say immediately that "Well that's alright then." I went to a conference where this guy (http://endocrinedisruptors.missouri.edu/pdfarticles/pdflist.html) presented his research on bisphenol a and since have followed the plastics story pretty closely and there is really no doubt, among those who study phthalates and bpa, that they are indeed quite harmful. The plastics in question are classified as Generally Accepted as Safe early on for use in foods, after testing for TOXICOLOGICAL effects in animals rather than developmental. That means they used doses way higher than actually get leeched out and looked for the wrong type of changes in the animals. The changes that take place aren't nausea and puking, they're feminization of masculine brains or screwups in chromosomal sequestration in developing eggs, and they occur in doses ten- or a hundredfold less than what was originally tested. Punch "phthalates" into the scholarly databases (try pubmed for instance) and you will get a huge number of articles back telling you in detail about their badness. You'll also get a couple, industry-funded, studies finding no ill effects, which are the ones that you will find cited by the plastics council.

Forgive me, but I like this subject a lot and have done a great deal of reading on it and have a hard time holding back when I hear it mentioned

[mikem]

Oh and most people rinse their mouth after brushing their teeth, right? Coz that's what I did before I entered dental school and learned that I've been doing it wrong for my entire life. If you rinse straight after brushing then you're effectively removing the fluoride.

What are you supposed to do? I had fluoride in my tooth paste and my mouth rinse, but I do get a bit lazy about using the mouth rinse. :boggled:

On the other hand I've had pretty good teeth my whole life so I guess I'm not too high risk.

[Steve]

What are you supposed to do? I had fluoride in my tooth paste and my mouth rinse, but I do get a bit lazy about using the mouth rinse. :boggled:

On the other hand I've had pretty good teeth my whole life so I guess I'm not too high risk.

Well apparently, the correct thing to do is spit out all the foamy stuff after your done brushing but don't rinse your mouth out.

I'm guessing, and I'm not 100% sure but either the fluoride mouth rinse makes up for the fact or you have certain factors that naturally favour healthy teeth.

Like me, personally, I used to be really lazy as a kid and almost never brushed my teeth yet I have no fillings and never had any problems with my teeth. The only thing I can think of is that my parents never really let me pig out on sweets or soft drinks.

[Riinuka]

Saliva composition also has quite a bit to do with it. As a kid, I loved soda, and still have quite the addiction, though it's curbed now.

I didn't brush my teeth as rigorously as I should have, but I've never had cavities.. My dentist was a bit baffled, and pairing that with my late onset of my major molars/wisdom teeth, I made for quite the spectacle..

The cavity conundrum was solved with a saliva test where they figured out what was in it, and the acidity of it. Mine's unusually basic for my age (usually goes from less acidic to more as you reach puberty from what I gathered).

[qwert]

Someone should make sugarless gum fortified with fluoride.

[Steve]

Saliva composition also has quite a bit to do with it. As a kid, I loved soda, and still have quite the addiction, though it's curbed now.

I didn't brush my teeth as rigorously as I should have, but I've never had cavities.. My dentist was a bit baffled, and pairing that with my late onset of my major molars/wisdom teeth, I made for quite the spectacle..

The cavity conundrum was solved with a saliva test where they figured out what was in it, and the acidity of it. Mine's unusually basic for my age (usually goes from less acidic to more as you reach puberty from what I gathered).

Cool, yeah saliva composition one of many factors that I was too lazy to mention. It's lucky for you that you have basic saliva.

These days, I tend to pig out a lot but my teeth are still fine but I tend to get calculus easily so I suspect my saliva might have a high composition of calcium and fluoride ions.

[mikem]

Someone should make sugarless gum fortified with fluoride.

This has existed for a long long time. I knew a girl in high school who rarely brushed her teeth because she figured such dental gum was "good enough".